Several of you have mentioned the lack of a coherent strategy. But there was one! The aim when Pulis left was to build the team around a core of players produced by the academy, supplemented by a few high quality purchases and some experienced pros. We were going to play expansive attacking football. And all our teams, from the under-18s upwards were to develop in the same way, so that the transition from junior to eventual first teamer was as seamless as possible. Most of us welcomed this as a positive way forward, especially as it seemed to recognise the financial realities of our situation once parachute payments dried up. It seemed a sensible, long-term view. It might take a few years to come to fruition, but would be successful in the long run.
Of course, where that master plan went wrong was to appoint a rookie manager who brought in an inexperienced coaching team. He tried to move to the new style of football too soon, seemingly not realising that this was going to take much longer to embed. He quickly needed to revert to former methods when he realised that the players at his disposal weren’t actually able to make the switch. From then on, things have unraveled badly and the vision seems to have been abandoned.
You could say it’s not the first time. A few years ago - was it under Karanka? - the plan was to link our academy up with enterprising clubs abroad and to sign promising European or South American youngsters whom we could develop then sell on at a profit. We had Peter Kenyon advising us. We brought in the 2 Brazilian lads from Juninho’s Ituano. But very little else arose from this much-vaunted and apparently laudable project. It rose, and sank, without trace. Quality recruitment may well have been the problem again, or perhaps it was the departure of Victor Orta?
Whatever, it’s clear from these two examples that MFC have chopped and changed vision and philosophy without ever seeing anything through. I would have thought that projects such as these require the serious long-term investment and commitment of everyone in the football club if they are to succeed. The fact that they have fallen by the wayside suggests either that this hasn’t happened, that the ground wasn’t adequately prepared in the first place to provide the necessary conditions for success, or that management soon realised that their grand plans weren’t actually attainable after all.
I wonder if there was (is) a simple plan, namely to survive in the Championship this season and then offload a good number of our more expensive players, to be replaced by the excellent stream of young players coming out of Rockliffe along with some new cheaper signings. That would create a more economical sustainable base from which to regrow the club.
Clearly, relegation does not fit ideally with this plan but the rebuild could happen just the same.
Long term, is this the only way that the club survives?
utb
Whatever, it’s clear from these two examples that MFC have chopped and changed vision and philosophy without ever seeing anything through. I would have thought that projects such as these require the serious long-term investment and commitment of everyone in the football club if they are to succeed. The fact that they have fallen by the wayside suggests either that this hasn’t happened, that the ground wasn’t adequately prepared in the first place to provide the necessary conditions for success, or that management soon realised that their grand plans weren’t actually attainable after all.
So true. We have had ideas but have never executed them properly. I like the latest plan and Woody was given a three (?) year contract to execute it. Where the plan went wrong was that we were not looking to survive this summer.
I hope we continue with the grand plan. I really do. So we need to bring in a manger that is believing in the plan. I think Woody did. Maybe the problem was he didn't have an experienced side kicking as an assistant.
But the plan was there. I cincerely hope it won't be abandoned again.
Excellent post, Clive. Up the Boro!
"I was critical of my boys, because they are not critical enough with themselves, with each other.
It's something very important for the team to grow and for that you need to demand from each other and be strong personalities.
A team of nice boys, the only thing they can win is the Fair Play Cup, which is something that I never won and I am not interested in."
Interesting comments from Mourinho about his teams.
Although, Mourinho's methodology is notorious for using this notion of creating conflict within the group in order to spark more energy to gain an extra few percent on the pitch. While this works in the short-term it does tend to leave the club and players mentally exhausted after two years, which often is the time he moves on either by choice or by 'mutual agreement' with a big pay-off.
You could say that Boro had something similar under Karanka but the conflict within the squad didn't quite work in our favour as the squad was ultimately split with factions and we seemed to lose more a than a few extra percent in performances as our PL season went downhill.
I'm always wary of managers once they start blaming the personalities of the players and indeed read this morning that Warnock has claimed that Boro will need restructuring after this season even if the stay up - although it didn't say in what way.
I would prefer it if Warnock didn't open this argument at this precise point as in reality his job is to essentially boost the players performance in the next few weeks and encourage more out of them. I don't think now is the time for home truths and risking having players believing that they're not the right ones to be here in the long term.
Perhaps it sounds more like getting your excuses in early in case the results don't come but most of what we're hearing from Warnock is that the players lack leadership, can't pass, can't shoot and are not really the right players - while it may have some truth, it won't help to boost their confidence or performances.
Mourinho was just trying to distract attention from the fact his players got into an altercation on the pitch. It’s called spin.
I’ll just keeping on banging my little drum for a wingback setup:
Stojanovic/Pears
Shotton Moukoudi Fry
Spence Howson Clayton Coulson
Roberts Tavernier
Fletcher
No line-up or shape is a substitute for endeavour or execution but at least with that side you get pace and width, some solidity through the centre and mobility and energy in the final third. Crucially, every player is played in their natural position, helping them to carry out their duties in a way they are most familiar with, and minimising unnecessary complications.
Also, with Friend, Djiksteel, Johnson, Saville, Wing and Britt on the bench, there is natural cover for every position - you don’t need to change the tactics to cover for an injury or two in those games as they come thick and fast.
There’s no magic wand to suddenly turn the side into winners but there are ways to keep it simple for players and put out a balanced XI.
That, along with the leadership from NW that he has bemoaned the lack of from his squad whilst seemingly playing them down in a crisis - bewildering by the way - can give us a chance.
It’s not over yet.
@andy-r that is roughly my preference but we would be torn apart down the left. Fry has struggled on the left of a three but then so has everyone.
I would probably choose Seville over Clayton and have Howson as the sitting midfielder; I think he has a better range of passing.
It's just I think that Woodgate committed to 4 at the back and Warnock is used to that too. You could say that another change of formation can't make things any worse but I've noticed that you always can make things worse.
@andy-r I would agree with that Andy.
Already there has been too much tinkering and yes the words fron Mr Warnock in public are not welcome.
We need three at the back to cover as best we can for our defensive frailties, and certainly more pace. Last throw of the dice now, chose and stick with it.
I can’t help but think a ridged 4-4-2 is the way to go. Basic football and don’t get beaten at all costs.
@andy-r that is roughly my preference but we would be torn apart down the left. Fry has struggled on the left of a three but then so has everyone.
I would probably choose Seville over Clayton and have Howson as the sitting midfielder; I think he has a better range of passing.
It's just I think that Woodgate committed to 4 at the back and Warnock is used to that too. You could say that another change of formation can't make things any worse but I've noticed that you always can make things worse.
Last season under Pulis, I thought Fry did well on the left of a three and brings the ball out well. I have Clayton in there on the left of the two central midfielders to patrol that area, and do very little else. He and Howson would have the brief have covering a specific square of the field in front of the centre halves and behind the wingbacks. A simple instruction to protect, marshal, win it back and give it to the wingbacks and creative midfielders.
@grovehillwallah. I have in the past said that in my view 442 or 4411 works well in this league but we also have players who could make three at the back work effectively as Andy has said albeit Fry is better on the right than the left but not at the expense of playing Shotton there.
The key to it all in my view is square pegs in square holes. All too often over the last few seasons we have seen players being played out of their natural position and whilst it might work in the short term and only out of necessity it should be avoided if possible.
The sale of Flint in my view has backfired spectacularly, particularly as it was because JW wanted ball playing centre halves to go with his all new attacking style!
Pears
Shotton Fry Moukoudi Friend
Spence Howson McNair Coulson
Roberts Fletcher
We need to be solid and play as a unit, not as a bunch of individuals having a kick about which is what we have seen in three of the four games so far.
I said when NW was appointed that I feared it was too late and sadly so far I have not see anything to convince me otherwise. 😎☹️
We might need to rest some players because its two games per week (or as Pulis would say three). There is no time to rest or heel small niggles between matches now.
So won't be surpriced to see a player or two who has not played much under NW tomorrow.
I think we must get some points from unexpected sources now. Hence I will go for a narrow 0-1 victory for the once-mighty Boro. Assombalonga after 33 min. And then lucky as Millwall miss a few chances.
Up the Boro,
Warnock press conference quote:
”“We probably have a shortage of strikers and defenders. We do have good wing-backs.”
Is that a hint at the shape for tomorrow? Needless to say that I blumming hope so!
Stojanovic/Pears
Shotton Moukoudi Fry
Spence Howson Clayton Coulson
Roberts Tavernier
Fletcher
I'd agree with Andy's set up except I would put Fry where Moukoudi is and play Friend on the left of the back three. I know Friend seems to be struggling with fitness but there is understanding between those three in that they have played and trained together for a few years now. Moukoudi looks good and I think has a bright future but I don't think now is the time to throw in another conundrum.
Other than that I agree with the Wing Backs as I think it best suits this squad (we don't have enough defenders as it is). I think Coulson is more an attacking Left Wing Back or Winger even. I think Spence is the same on the right, great going forwards but suspect defensively. With that in mind, to me it means that we can only go with a back three. A back four is for another time when we have the squad qualities to play it.
Its all about winning games now, much better to win one and lose one than draw two, we don't have enough games left to go solid, hard to break down and catching them on the break. I think Tav has enough in his locker to cause problems and probably be on a similar wavelength to Roberts than any other player currently at the Club, likewise Fletcher who is sprightly and good in the air to meet balls in the box (with the proviso that they are not over-hit).
Howson and Clayton offer experience behind the front three and should be solid at defending and covering for the marauding Wing Backs. Howson also has a shot in him and remember when we used to joke about Shottinho for his runs? We have to embrace the scant resources that we do have and put our trust back in them.
Shotton, Friend, Howson, Clayton all have experience, none of them may be that strong stand out Leader but there is enough between the four to talk the younger ones through and to keep shape. Spence, Coulson, Tav and Roberts have speed, trickery and energy which at this level should give any side including Leeds, West Brom and Brentford a game in this Division. Accommodating Assombalonga for his price tag I'm afraid is a luxury we cannot afford at the moment so it has to be Fletcher up front.
I had no idea that both goal scorers at Stoke were dropped for the next game at Hull. That is a monstrous stat and explains a lot about this club. When you cannot buy a goal you pray for some kid who suddenly bursts onto the scene and wins you a couple of games on the trot.
Was he asked for an explanation? If not why not?
This is the same wild selections that got us to this point. I am seriously alarmed by this news, it is the logic of the lunatic asylum, and got the result it deserved. One is forced to the conclusion that there is no one at the club telling him the blunders made by Woodgate, and who will be snapped up in the fire sale, and who will be without a club come the end of the season. I repeat, one of the most amazing stats even we have produced, and god knows we have produced plenty.
Werder
To pick a manager who fits the players we have, is to condemn us, the fans, to an eternity of the same thing we have been served, and, I might say are being served Right now.
Just watched NW’s latest press conference, once again he was remarkably subdued by his own standards. No talk of promise from the players in training, no players singled out for praise ( some would be ge-ed up by that). Once again bemoaning the lack of quality players and a bewilderment of how lopsided the squad is.
He’s obviously had time to make an assessment of the task at hand, and seemed to struggle to sound positive. No rallying battle cries and a distinct lack of optimism. He was given very easy questions from very amiable “reporters”.
If he was a Doctor I would suggest his bedside manner was akin to preparing relatives for some bad news coming. Perhaps my interpretation is wrong, but this wasn’t the brash abrasive Neil Warnock we would all recognise.
His face was that of a mechanic who’d been asked to overhaul and tune up an engine and found only an old screwdriver a roll of duct tape and a ball pein hammer in the toolbox.
GHW
Many thanks for sending me John Nicholson’s book ‘Can we have our Football back’. Most folk know my observations that Football existed before the advent of the Premier League especially where goalscoring records are concerned. However this book looks as if it is advocating radical changes, so I’m looking forward to reading John Nicholson’s proposals. Many thanks again then for your kindness in sending me this book, I’ll look forward to reading it in my garden.
Ken Smith
Not a bad set or results for us this evening.
However, I suspect we’ll need to beat Millwall tomorrow to climb out of the bottom three. I fancy Hull to get something at Bristol City.
Win and we could shoot up to 18th.