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Politics Forum susp...
 

Politics Forum suspended

 

werdermouth
Site Creator Webmaster
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 560
Topic starter  

I'd just like to take the opportunity to remind everyone that I've set up this new discussion forum with the view of encouraging thoughtful intelligent debate and a sensible exchange of views in order to explore topics and engage in conversation.

While the core topic is to discuss all matters Boro and football, I was also hopeful that more complex subjects and even political issues could be also discussed without the conversation getting personal, becoming divisive or drifting into rambling rants.

I'm also unfortunately the person responsible for ensuring any content doesn't cross a line of what admittedly will subjectively regarded as acceptable or not.

OK, what is acceptable to individuals will differ but since I'm running the site and am also legally responsible to ensure content complies with the hosting company's terms and conditions, I will apply my judgement and will aim to be objective when deciding. However, I certainly didn't set up this forum to make more work for myself and spend a lot of time editing posts to make them suitable or even intervening in arguments.

I've probably now spent close to two hour on such matters arising from yeserday, which also resulted in dinner being delayed by nearly an hour as I had to dealt with a number posts that needed immediate attention to avoid further responses that may also have needed attention.

It has made me wonder whether broader discussion is something I want to continue to facilitate as I just don't have the time to get involved in the requirement to moderate posts and subsequent responses - plus write responses and explanations.

This has been particularly a problem with posts on Black Lives Matter campaign, which has proved a lot more controversial, political and divisive than I thought and I've now moved that thread to the Politics forum.

However, having reflected on yesterday, I've decided for the foreseeable future to suspend posting on the Politics forum as it's becoming a distraction and am concerned it will create bad feeling between members and impact on participation in the main point of Diasboro in discussing all matters on Boro and football.

The General Discussion still remains open to explore other topics but if I deem a topic too controversial or straying overtly into politics I will remove it.

Of course almost everybody on this forum continues to contribute in the manner that we have always tried to achieve and since we're all human we can all have the odd moment but will hopefully recognise that and try to make amends.

As always I'm grateful for all your fine contributions but this is just a gentle reminder to remember to exercise a bit of care when engaging in online conversation.

 

 

This topic was modified 12 months ago 3 times by werdermouth

grovehillwallah
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 561
 

I wish you could shut Twitter and 24 hr news down also. I long for the old days of the 9:00 News/News at 10, where the news was presented and wasn’t spun to suit any particular agenda.


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Boro Beckys Dad
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 88
 

Werder - totally understand your stance on the politics section - that is not the aim of this forum. 

You should not be expected to spend so much time on this kind of stuff, especially given all the fantastic work you have done on this site.

 Virtual  pint for you Sir.

 

Ps - I still think there is a case for some of your costs incurred to be covered by us members


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John Richardson
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 232
 

 

Boro Becky's Dad, And I'll get the next round. Well done Werder.

UTB,

John


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Martin Bellamy
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 180
 

If I’m responsible for any issues I apologise unreservedly. 


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grovehillwallah
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 561
 

I just get the impression that the media end up in a race to the bottom in order to be first with their slant on the news.

Yesterday it was “big” news when NASCAR drivers paraded Bubba Wallace (the only black driver on the circuit) after a Noose was found hanging in his garage. Today it turns out that it was an old piece of rope used to pull down a door that had been hanging there for a year. All this instead of highlighting why there is only one black NASCAR driver. The fact that most sports are elitist and prohibit ( with the exception of football) most poor people both black and white is ignored.

A lot of activists shared a tweet from Serena Williams but later found out it was from a white woman and not the tennis star. ( despite her profile saying NOT that Serena).

The media still don’t get it. The vast majority of people just go about their daily lives and couldn’t give a stuff what the various news outlets deem to be important.

 


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lenmasterman
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 222
 

Agree with you Werder. Your dedicated and intelligent work for which we are all grateful deserve better than all of the recent hassle you have had to endure.

BLM is not a political issue, simply a matter of standing (or kneeling) in support of those who suffer racist abuse.  A symbol of respect for one's fellow human beings, work colleagues and friends. Millions of people have peacefully supported or been part of this movement across the world, and there is hope that it can become a vehicle for peaceful dialogue and change for a better future for all of us.

I do not think that there  are any racists posting on this blog, but getting worked up about peripheral issues relating to statues or the culture wars is missing the bigger picture.  The whole world saw and was disgusted by what George Floyd suffered at the hands of a law enforcement officer, and also recognised that this was a symbol of the systemic abuse suffered by black people at the hands of the police and the criminal justice system for decades and even centuries. 

There now seems to be a critical mass of people across North America and Europe who are saying enough is enough, and that we have to engage in serious dialogue about the nature and degree of systemic racial discrimination in our institutions, companies, and corporations.  Football has been ripe for just such an examination for decades, and it is heartening to see the solidarity of players of all creeds and colours in their condemnation of the vile racial abuse that many of their team have to suffer on a weekly basis.  We all know that the perpetrators are a tiny minority of thugs, whose activities could be quickly terminated if the police and the clubs themselves were really determined to do it. 

But we can do our part. We can go beyond saying that we are not racist ourselves by opposing casual or active racism wherever we encounter it.  That is what the Black Lives Matter movement should encourage us to do.  But if we are more scandalised by graffiti or the damage to statues than by the killing of a black person then we are inadvertently doing the work of racists for them.

 


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Pedro de Espana
Member
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 147
 

I am truly sorry Werder that you have had to intervene and suspend the Politic’s Forum.
We all appreciate the time and effort that you have had to give, in setting up this new Website and the continual commitment keeping it going.

My first post, I believe, included that we were spoilt for choice and the inclusion of the Politics section amongst expanding other lines for a brave decision.

I would be the first to admit, that at times, a post I write turns into more than it should be. But we can all get carried away somewhat, but again it is only the Boro and football.

When Politics comes to be subject then the redline has to be adhered to far more rigidly and therefore I totally support your suspension of that section. Comments around this topic always upset people far more than say football. Likewise keep away from religion.

I am certain that all the members apologise for this distraction and the upset it has given.

This post was modified 12 months ago by Pedro de Espana

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Pedro de Espana
Member
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 147
 

Just going back to pre COVID-19 and further references by Members, it was proposed that we seriously think about covering the costs incurred on a regular basis by yourself and Redcar Red. You mentioned just the other day an extra fee that you had just paid. 

Whilst I appreciate that you both carry out your roles “freely” no pun intended, and have never sought reimbursement I believe that the time has come to introduce a “contribution system” not unlike you see with some of the Newspapers and internet software downloads.

Some members may propose an amount, or it could be left to the individual. However because we do not know the annual running costs we may need some guidance. I also appreciate Redcar Reds expenses are somewhat different.

I do hope that I have not any caused offence with this post. I just believe that there is no such thing as a free lunch.

 


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Boro Beckys Dad
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 88
 

Totally agree Pedro - I pay for access to a newspaper site on a ad HoC basis and would do the same for this site.

There is indeed no such thing as a free lunch and there is the adage that you do not value something that is free.

Even if Werder and RR do not feel able to accept money themselves, how about a donation to a charity of their choice? 


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grovehillwallah
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 561
 

I thought MFC was our charity of choice.

😉

 

Only kidding, I’d be happy to contribute or donate to a worthy cause like Zoe’s Place.


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billy
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 81
 

@grovehillwalla allways happy to donate to Zoes Place. I was back in UK in September and attended the Reading game, lots of the kids met the players pre- match and it brought a tear to my eye.

Undecided what to get my fit and healthy 1 year old grand daughter for her birthday, I made a donation on her behalf. 

Also the staff do a fantastic job, maybe they deserve a beer or two


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Redcar Red
Member
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 638
 

Many thanks Pedro but I wouldn't be comfortable with that generous gesture. I'm happy to do what I do because it is almost therapeutic supporting Boro being able to offload or in the rare occasion share euphoria. Its a shame this Forum wasn't alive during the early Gibson years when there was non stop adventure.

Its a fans forum and its something I do with a passion or I should say did as it has been extremely testing this season to either get behind or have hope and belief in Boro. Saturday for me was just about a tipping point when I was so fed up of the whole farcical set up I literally couldn't be bothered to proof read my own article. Something inside me was of the opinion that if the Players, Management and Club aren't bothered why am I? Here we are four days later and there has been a major head change at the club and my candle is flickering once more!

In life I figure that we should try and give out more than we take back. My costs are what they are regardless and I don't incur anything that I wouldn't be paying for anyway so it just wouldn't feel right. I can provide my input for what its worth free of charge and hopefully others get something out of it even if they disagree.

I firmly believe that forums such as this are extremely helpful (or at least insightful) to the club. Most industries have to pay a fortune for their market research albeit I would wager that "MFC the business" is not always appreciative of some of the feedback. Nevertheless it provides information and knowledge should someone there take the time to look through the various forums.

There are quite a few forums on Boro, some which seem to attract trolls with one line put downs to contributors but nothing to back up their stance. Some with a mixture of well informed contributors but with a few shock jocks goading for a reaction and one in particular which seems to be engaged in constant insults, vitriol and threats of personal violence. I like to think that on here we have a more thoughtful, measured and mature clientele and whilst we are no less passionate the views are at least constructive in the main with the hope that Boro constantly refine and improve.

Maybe my amateurish Journalistic efforts will earn some reward in the Holgate in the sky when my time comes but meantime sharing my views just acts as a catalyst to spark debate and opinion even though we may disagree on things (sometimes very passionately). At the start I didn't really give much thought to creating a match report, it was more to save what AV had set up and created and not let it be lost especially as I suspect some would have hoped it would. My alliteration is nowhere near the Premier League status of our founder but his creation lives on.

I hope we all get something from Diasboro and if nothing else it is a lot cheaper than therapy for our woes. What we get out of it I suspect will be different things for different people but its only of interest because of all of our collective posts and discussions. I have no problem if Werder wants to maybe stick the odd advert here and there to cover the administration costs of the site. I doubt the number of clicks on here would ever amount to a fortune but it may cover the odd Euro here and there for him?

 

This post was modified 12 months ago 2 times by Redcar Red

Pedro de Espana
Member
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 147
 

Thank you RR for a lovely and thoughtful reply. 


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werdermouth
Site Creator Webmaster
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 560
Topic starter  

Just making my first visit to the forum since this morning as I've dedicated most of the day to making progress on my latest project. Thanks for your responses to my decision and I've also been heartened by some emails received from members who were involved in the problematic discussion.

Also thanks for the offer assistance with running costs but that isn't necessary as I'm in agreement with Redcar Red in that we do this because we're happy to do it and I'm also of the view if you're able to make something that people find useful from pursuing an interest then that's payment enough - besides I've managed to keep costs to an absolute minimum and my outgoings financially are well under a euro a week, which Mrs Werder hasn't even missed 🙂

Not bad compared to the somewhere between €300-400 per year that it would have cost to produce the same site on Wordpress.com but knowledge, know-how and research have value in such matters.

Actually, the one thing that does have a cost but doesn't have a price is time and I'm always short on that with an endless list of things to do, so the most important thing anyone on Diasboro can give me, which will be gratefully received, is helping to avoid unnecessary demands on this precious commodity as I'd also prefer to use it doing something positive that is creative and adds something to life.

OK, I'm back on kitchen duties again and I also promised my son we'd play a game before he goes to bed - thanks again for the messages!

This post was modified 12 months ago by werdermouth

jarkko
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 593
 

@redcarred RR, I hope to share a place with you in the Holgate when not able to attend the Riverside Stadium or Live in this World. 

Excellent post. Up the Boro! 


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nigelreeve
Member
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 27
 

I was looking forward to engaging in the politics forum, its a real pity it hasn't quite worked out.


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Ken Smith
Mr
Joined: 12 months ago
Posts: 793
 

It’s taken me sometime to find this particular discussion page as I tend to give my two pennies worth of opinions following the excellent pre-match reviews of Werdermouth and the equally excellent match reports of Redcar Red. What has been mentioned by the two afore mentioned gentlemen is though they ‘do it for the love of our football club’ which shines through even in the times when sometimes the football on the pitch and sometimes behind the scenes must have stretched their patience. Let’s not forget that these two gentlemen are still in employment and also have families to consider as major commitments on their time but still find their input on this forum as therapeutic. I can understand that. I have much more time on my hands but reviewing and reliving the past especially the history of our great club has become cathartic for me.
 I didn’t find sharing what I have read about Boro’s history a chore, as it fills a gap in my life since the demise of my wife. Having completed my history of Boro as far as I thought was suitable, I’ve since started to recapitulate on what I consider were the most significant League seasons in more detail with goalscorers and match attendances. After that I’ll probably review all Cup runs where Boro reached at least the Quarter Final stage. I still update all current scores in my register, I’m not clever enough to have them computerised. Most Boro fans aren’t as interested as I in the history of our club, but that’s not the point, I do it as a hobby and even if few people read my statistics it doesn’t matter as it’s recorded there on this website. Like Werdermouth and Redcar Red I do it for the love of the club I’ve always supported if not always as a spectator, but always as a statistician.


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