I was thinking about "generations" of managers. Chris Wilder at 54 years old is pretty much of the same generation as Tony Mowbray and Steve Bruce. They've been managing for 20 years or longer. Obviously, with age comes experience but also the risk of becoming set in your ways. At the top of the game you have Guardiola and Klopp who are 51 and 54 respectively. Likewise, ten Hag is 52. Looking at that, I think Wilder is somewhere near his peak mix of experience and age.
What's also notable to me in the Championship is that many of the best performing clubs have managers in their 1st or 2nd major job. No real conclusion to be drawn but I suspect that Wilder feels the clock is ticking. He's made no secret about wanting to manage in the Premier league as he's only done it for a year and a bit in 20+ years of management.
30+ years Neil Warnock
20+ years: Steve Bruce, Tony Mowbray, Chris Wilder
10-20 years: Mark Warburton, Mark Robins, Michael O'Neill, Marco Silva
5- 10 years: Nathan Jones, Gary Rowett, Paul Heckingbottom,
<5 years Russell Martin, Carlos Corberan, Steve Cooper, Scott Parker
Reverting to my first previous blog at 4.58 on the 11th May, apart from Villa’s dominance in the years leading up to 1900 when they won 5 of their 7 titles, Huddersfield’s 3 titles and 2 as runners up in the mid 1920s, and Arsenal’s 4 titles in 5 years and one as runner up in the 1930s most successive title wins only lasted twice with Sheffield Wednesday in 1903 and 1904, and again in 1929 and 1930. Incidentally Manchester United spent 12 of their formative years in the Second Division, plus 3 more successive years there in the 1920’s, and yet another 5 successive years there in the early 1930’s.
Even after the Second World War multiple title winners were rare with Portsmouth’s only two titles coming in 1949 and 1950, Chelsea’s solitary title win in 1955 before the arrival of Roman Abramovitch, Wolves 3 title wins coming in a period of 5 years followed by Burnley’s only 2nd title since 1921, Ipswich Town’s one title under Alf Ramsey in their first season after promotion in 1962, Leeds United’s 2 title wins and 5 as runners up under Don Revie in a 6 year period from 1965 to 1974, Derby County’s 2 titles and one 3rd place under the enigmatic Brian Clough who also managed Nottingham Forest to their only title win although winning two European Cup Final wins, the League title coming the year after gaining promotion in 3rd place in the Second Division.
Liverpool’s dominance of First Division title wins in the mid 1970s to the end of the 1980s when they won 10 of their titles, was the only time generally speaking that one club monopolised the First Division, but apart from Chelsea of those pre-war winners none of them only possibly Spurs who won the title in 1951 and 1961 or Newcastle, are likely to win the Premier League in the future unless drastic changes are made. It surely can’t be right that only a handful of clubs have any hope of Premier League success year after year in what is purported to be the best League in Europe if not the World.
The English pyramid system is the envy of the World, but suddenly comes to a stop when reaching the heights of the Premier League, and maybe even government legislation is required to save football before the satellite broadcasters pull the plug. This season has seen the emergence of Brighton and Crystal Palace to mid table but not enough to challenge the top six.
I will review the Championship and Leagues One and Two later when time permits.
I suppose it could be argued that longevity is the sign of a successful manager as they were perceived to have done well enough to be offered another job - though on that basis you wouldn't want be the club who turned out to be the last employer of a manager.
Having said that, managers need to keep their tactics current as football moves on as other coaches adapt to dealing with teams who present different challenges. Perhaps the decline of Jose Mourinho or even Arsene Wenger have shown that - plus maybe more recently clubs in the PL worked out how to counter against Bielsa and maybe even Chris Wilder's tactics that worked so well in his first top-flight season at Sheff Utd.
Although, by far the most successful tactic is to have better players than the opposition - which seems to be the preferred method of the top managers these days 😉
Although, by far the most successful tactic is to have better players than the opposition - which seems to be the preferred method of the top managers these days 😉
I think Brian Clough and Peter Taylor - especially the latter - were very good in spotting players and playing them in the right place. I do not think there were any special tactics but forming good players as a team was key. Football is a simple game complicated by many.
Up the Boro!
Fist club in history to lose three successive FA Cup Finals... 😳
Couldn't have happened to a better club 😉
On another note it was a good win for Forest today.
EXMIL CHALLENGE 2022 - Playoff Semi Finals - Halftime Scores
werdermouth 17 jarkko 16
KP in Spain 17 Norfolk and Boro 19
All still to play for !
Come on BORO.
The Premier League clubs will complete their fixtures next Sunday and generally speaking points wise there has been little difference amongst the top 8 clubs performances from last season to this season considering that 14 clubs still have 2 matches remaining, whilst 5 clubs have 3 matches remaining. However Leicester City are at the moment 21 points short of last year’s 21 points, Manchester United with only one match at Crystal Palace to play are 16 points short of last season’s 74 points, Leeds United 25 adrift of last season’s 59, and Everton 23 adrift of last season’s 59. The biggest riser is Brighton already 6 points ahead of iast season’s total with still 2 matches remaining. Remember they were promoted via the playoffs only 6 years ago when Boro won automatic promotion - one has to ask oneself where Boro went wrong?
The Championship has seen the fall of Swansea from 4th to 15th and conceding a massive 29 more goals than last season, Barnsley dropping from 5th to 24th, Reading from 7th to 21st and conceding 33 more goals than last season’s 50, and Cardiff dropping from 8th to 18th and scoring 16 fewer whilst conceding 19 more than last season. The two most successful turnarounds have been the 2 clubs likely to meet in the Playoff Final, Nottm. Forest who have risen from 17th to 4th, and Huddersfield risen from 20th to 3rd yet Boro took 9 points from them this season.
Even League One had it’s turnarounds with Lincoln falling from 5th to 17th, Gillingham from 12th to 21st, Crewe from 14th to 24th, and Doncaster from 16th to 22nd and 26 points fewer than last season’s 64 points. The biggest risers were Plymouth from 18th to 7th and scoring 15 more goals and conceding 32 fewer. However the biggest turnaround was from Wigan Athletic who only escaped relegation to League Two by one point last season to finishing as Champions this season, and for that I make them the team of the season.
In League Two it was sad to see the demise of Scunthorpe but especially Oldham Athletic who were founder members of the inaugural Premiership although the writing had been on the wall last season. Carlisle were also a surprise as at one time they were in the playoff position last season but finished 10th but struggled this season into 20th position after at one time looking like relegation candidates. However Mansfield who finished 16th last season and looked likely to be in a relegation dogfight this season scraped into the playoffs in 7th position and take a 2-1 lead into next week’s Second Leg against Northampton. Similarly Port Vale who finished 13th last season just missed out on automatic promotion but finished 5th and will play Swindon twice over the next few days for a chance of reaching the Playoff Final.
So that’s it folks for now, but I’ll write about the National Leagues and review the minor leagues, especially our local teams sometime next week.
Fist club in history to lose three successive FA Cup Finals... 😳
Couldn't have happened to a better club 😉
On another note it was a good win for Forest today.
🤛.
I know I have my typing errors, too and my English is not perfect. Up the Boro!
https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/mel-morris-set-to-suffer-3m-blow-after-derby-county-takeover/
What is the thoughts of diasboro.
Come on BORO.
Exmil
£3m that sounds like a lot more than I thought Boro would get.
It will be interesting to see if that value can be substantiated at a later date and not some journalistic pie in the sky
OFB
https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/mel-morris-set-to-suffer-3m-blow-after-derby-county-takeover/
What is the thoughts of diasboro.
Come on BORO.
The sad thing about this whole saga is that it ever happened in the first place and is as a result of a proper lack of governance and oversight in the whole of football.
I am not sure how accurate the figure quoted is, given this was an undisclosed settlement but clearly we were disadvantaged by Derby's manipulation of the rules and it was only right in my view that there was some recompense.
It remains to be seen if the governing bodies, including the government, finally get there act together and appoint a regulator to try and ensure that these sort of abuses and ownership issues are not allowed to continue to demean the game we all love. 😎
Sad to hear of the death of Australian cricketer Andrew Symonds aged only 46 in a car crash. He was a larger than life all rounder who held the world record for the number of 6s in an innings in first class cricket until Ben Stokes surpassed that recently, and was also a fine bowler who could bowl both spin and medium pace, but also an excellent fielder in the covers like the late South African Colin Bland who I once witnessed as a schoolboy at Scarborough many years ago.
It’s been a devastating year for Australian cricket with the shocking demise of both Shane Warne and Rodney Marsh also and hard to take when a loved one loses one’s life in a car crash which I myself have experienced when my father suffered the same fate in 1969. It’s that knock on the door from the police that lives with one forever.
My thoughts and sympathies go out to Andy’s wife Laura and family. Rest in peace, big man.
We still live in a world where money seems to throw us a wobbler whenever it is mentioned, which is a worry, because football is not dominated by money, it is constructed out of money in unimaginable heaps. The incidental costs of a large deal would be ten times the amount we are getting from Derby, and please note I do not mean the giant deals. Example! The latest wonder striker to Man City. About 35 to the Young player, about 25 to his agent, a further 50 in rights to various people, plus the fee about 60-70 to city all numbers are of course in millions. If you want a laugh, City stole him in a really cheap deal.
Looking at the scoring system in speedway matches the points for home matches are similar to football with 3 points for a win and 1 point for a draw, but there’s a bigger incentive for away teams with 4 points for an away win and an extra point viz 2 points for a scoring draw with goalless draws remaining 1 point each. It would certainly liven up the dreary Italian Serie A, but would it be a welcome innovation in the English Leagues?
Looking at the scoring system in speedway matches the points for home matches are similar to football with 3 points for a win and 1 point for a draw, but there’s a bigger incentive for away teams with 4 points for an away win and an extra point viz 2 points for a scoring draw with goalless draws remaining 1 point each. It would certainly liven up the dreary Italian Serie A, but would it be a welcome innovation in the English Leagues?
Not with our away record Ken!
Before I review steps 7 and above of this season’s pyramid system, when Boro were playing away from home I used to sometimes watch Boro Reserves play at Ayresome Park because it was the only method of finding how the first team were performing via the scoreboard. This was before I had a paper round and Boro Reserves won the Northeastern League 6 times after the war whilst Sunderland Reserves, Spennymoor United and North Shields were the only other clubs to win it twice before it ceased to exist in 1964.
But the Teesside League always had a fascination for me with the likes of Acklam Steelworks, Blackett Hutton Welfare, Head Wrightson, Nunthorpe Athletic, Portrack Shamrocks (for whom Matt Busby made several guest appearances in 1945), Redcar Albion and Smith’s Dock all famous participants. I don’t know how many of those clubs are in existence today, but the South Bank and District League was a feeder league to the Teesside League in my adolescence.
However it was the Ellis Cup that put Teesside on the map, because it was such a prestigious Cup competition, in fact only the FA Cup and Scottish FA Cup were older knockout cup competitions. Cargo Fleet were the first club to win it 4 years in succession, and it was the starting point for several Boro players in their amateur days. For example Wilf Mannion (South Bank St Peters), Micky Fenton and Harold Shepherdson (both South Bank East End), George Hardwick (Saltburn FC) and Brian Clough (Great Broughton FC) all played in this competition usually played on the old South Bank ground with the Final sometimes played at Ayresome Park.
Now having got the history lesson out of the way, which clubs have been promoted from step 7 upwards which includes the North Riding Premier League, the champions being Boro Rangers made up of a lot of teenagers. Rangers have had a magnificent season winning 23 and drawing one of their 26 matches with a total of 138 goals scored and only 14 conceded. In fact in their final league match they beat Kader FC 17-0 and then won two playoff matches to earn promotion to the Northern League Second Division step 6.
The Northern League Second Division was won by Carlisle City with Heaton Stannington also promoted after the playoffs. As for our local teams Billingham Synthonia finished 8th (12 points behind Heaton Stannington) and Redcar Town 10th in their inaugural season 2 further points behind the Synners. The average attendances for Billingham was a disappointing 92 with a high of 190, whilst Redcar’s was 121 with a high of 220.
Step 5 which includes the Northern League Division One was won by North Shields with Consett also promoted via the playoffs. Our local clubs Thornaby FC finished 3rd, Guisborough Town 13th, Redcar Athletic 14th and Billingham Town last and unfortunately relegated, though they will have a couple of local derbies against the Synners to look forward to next season. Thornaby’s average attendance was 249 with a high of 417, Guisborough and Redcar’s average attendances were 283 with Guisborough’s high being 469 and Redcar’s 465, whilst Billingham’s average attendance being 184 with a high of 345. Unfortunately Redcar only won 6 and lost 12 of their home games including the home game against the Priorymen which attracted their highest gate of the season, yet won 9 and lost 9 of their away fixtures and completed the double over runners up Consett.
The Northern Premier League Division Two (step 4)was a magnificent season for Marske United and a good season for Stockton Town too. They finished 2nd and 4th respectively with the former beating Stockton in the playoffs to be promoted to Division One and local derbies against Whitby Town to look forward to next season. They also had a magnificent run in the qualifying rounds of the FA Cup with an emphatic 4-0 away win at Chester in the 3rd Qualifying Round before succumbing to Gateshead who have just become champions of the National League North. Stockton had the highest average attendance in the whole league with 633 and a high of 1,208 whilst Marske were 2nd with an average of 522 and a high of 1,474 although a maximum capacity of 1,500 tickets were printed for the Playoff Final which Marske won 2-1 against Stockton.
Step 3 of the pyramid system includes 4 Leagues, three from the South and one from the North - the Northern Premier League Division One. Whitby Town flirted with the top 4 playoffs all season but eventually finished five points short in 7th position whilst Scarborough Athletic won the playoffs and along with champions Buxton will play in the National League North next season. Whitby’s average attendance was 547 with a high of 1,140 against Scarborough whose average home attendance was 1,145 with a high of 1,824. The promoted clubs as champions from the 3 Southern Leagues are Taunton Town, Banbury United and Worthing, and the playoff winners of Farnborough Town, Peterborough Sports and Cheshunt will join them in the National League South next season.
The National League North champions are Gateshead and the one match playoff winners of York City v Boston United will join them in the National League next season, whilst the National League South champions Maidstone United and the winners of Dorking Wanderers v Ebbsfleet United will join them. The National League champions Stockport County will return to EFL League Two whilst former League clubs Wrexham, FC Halifax Town, Grimsby Town and Chesterfield will start this week to see who will play Solihull Moors for a place in EFL League Two.
Thankfully this season has seen all clubs survive despite the continuation of some Covid 19 situations. I’ve always been a supporter of non league football and especially the strength of the Durham County teams who often dominated the FA Amateur Cup in my early childhood, but the establishment of the pyramid system has put English football to a new level. When one looks at some of the attendances they might seem sparse to some people, however they stand up well when compared to the First and Second Divisions of the Scottish League. Also there are always gems to be found such as Isiah Jones and particularly Jamie Vardy in the lower leagues.
Congratulations to all those clubs who have been promoted this season especially our local teams and better luck next season for those who have missed out.
Sorry Craig Johns, I don’t recall Boro dropping ANY points this season, it’s just that they didn’t win some matches that the fans and media thought they might GAIN. After all this is the Championship where any team on any given day can beat anyother. To my mind it’s this expectancy over the years that has sometimes held Boro back. All teams start matches with zero points, and it’s these hackneyed phrases that I find from the media especially so irritating . I’m also certain that even last season every club can use the same two words “if only”. Football as well as life one can look back and use those two little words. Think positive by all means, but accept that sometimes life doesn’t happen as one would wish it to sometimes.
Remember Jordan Rhodes who used to play for Boro ?
No pace, couldn’t hold the ball up, but deadly in the penalty area making goals look easy.
Some of you may have watched Huddersfield v Luton last night and witnessed his super goal.
On a separate issue how can the Luton manager be manager of the season ahead of Corbaran , the Huddersfield coach, who finished higher in the League and his team are at Wembley only one game away from the Premiership.
And all without spending a penny on new players last season.
Philip from Huddersfield
On a separate issue how can the Luton manager be manager of the season ahead of Corbaran , the Huddersfield coach, who finished higher in the League and his team are at Wembley only one game away from the Premiership.
And all without spending a penny on new players last season.Philip from Huddersfield
Perhaps this shows that a club must not make too many changes in one particular transfer window?
Remember the two promotions under Bruce Rioch or the record-breaking promotion under Big Jack? The former had no money to spend, the latter brought in just one or two reinforcements.
Like last season, we are looking forward to bringing in about eight new players. I would prefer to buy quality over quantity as ever. Every transfer is a chance that can go terribly wrong, too. As we have seen in the past two January windows.
I would concentrate on about four good players like a goalie, left-footed centre back and two strikers. In addition to possibly bringing back Balogun.
And bringing in just improvements, not journeymen. I would have also kept Bamba and Peltier for an extra season to have as few changes as possible.
But they seem to know better and hire a dozen every season. Up the Boro!
Philip
These awards should be made at the end of the season after the playoffs. Though my nomination would be Steve Cooper after taking Forest from relegation candidates to probably a Playoff Finalf
On a separate issue how can the Luton manager be manager of the season ahead of Corbaran , the Huddersfield coach, who finished higher in the League and his team are at Wembley only one game away from the Premiership.
And all without spending a penny on new players last season.Philip from Huddersfield
Perhaps this shows that a club must not make too many changes in one particular transfer window?
Huddersfield brought in a lot of players, they just didn't pay anything for them. According to Wikipedia they brought in 17 players in total (12 free transfers and 5 loans). Not sure how many of them were successful but clearly the club as a whole had a successful season.
By comparison we brought in 13 transfers and 5 loans. I think the issue is as much to do with coherence as it is with numbers. My understanding is that Corberan basically changed the whole defensive unit in order to get the team playing the way he wanted.
Wilder probably has to do something similar and massively overhaul the squad. It's just that we don't have an encouraging track record when it comes to recruiting.
It’s not only Boro who lost matches unexpectedly. Luton lost 3-0 at Birmingham and 0-5 at home to them also. They also lost 1-2 at home to Cardiff and only drew 1-1 at Peterborough as did Huddersfield who only drew at Barnsley and lost at Cardiff. Sheffield United were the worst though losing at home to Birmingham, Blackpool and Reading, only drawing at home to Reading, drawing at Bristol City and losing at Derby all matches they were expected to draw or at least draw or win. It’s a competitive league and sometimes some results are unexpected. Boro were no different in that regard. At the end of the day the league table doesn’t lie and Boro got their due deserts, how unpalatable that might seem to some fans and reporters.
You beat me to it Ken, in naming Cooper at Notts Forest. And as deleriad has just pointed out, it is who you bring in, not just what they cost.
Corberan has proven himself to be a good Coach this season and their Recruitment Team certainly looks to have given him a better set of tools to repair the Huddersfield Team than our useless lot at Rockcliffe.
I would like to see Steve Cooper and Nottingham Forest back in the premiership. Good luck to them tonight. As Ken says Cooper should be the manager of the year.
There's an interesting article by Craig Johns in which he writes about Gary Neville's comments regarding Boro and other major Northern clubs and their absence from the Premiership.
In particular Craig puts forward the view that he would prefer to see MFC continue in 'roughly' the position that they are now in the Championship rather than finding a place in the Premiership driven by lashings of external cash from someone who has none of the local links or sensibilities of Steve Gibson. If you had asked me this a few years ago I would probably have said 'give me the money' but now the world is in a different place and I do get a sense of pride from the community-facing stance that MFC take on so many issues, the family-friendly attitude that they have and the great work that they do in supporting the local area.
Given that Steve Gibson will, at some stage, want to pass on the baton, is it Utopian to hope that someone with money and reasonable morals may be out there to continue the work that is being done whilst also continuing to support the club through the financial pressures imposed by the current structure. I don't think that they have to be local - are there any local candidates - but an acceptance of the position that the club has in the community would seem to me to be a pre-requisite. Is there some way that this can be baked into the ownership structure. I would be interested to know how the German system impacts on the position that the 50+1 clubs have in their communities.
UTB
PS Spence's value must be going up every day. How much would we demand from Forest if they win the play-off final? I'm certainly starting to see a fee with a 2 in front of it and if it gets to an auction with some really big clubs involved we might see a major windfall.
What does the word ‘sport’ mean to the average person? The Oxford Dictionary describes sport as being a contest between individuals or teams facing each other in a fair contest with behaviour between participants showing equal respect for each other whether winning or losing. In general that still occurs amongst most participants but not always between supporters of their respective teams.
In the last few days I’ve heard of some very unsavoury moments admittedly among a small number of fans. In last week’s Rugby League match between Castleford and Hull Kingston Rovers some of the visiting fans were showering the home fans by throwing their plastic bottles into a crowd of Cas supporters after the home team scored a try in a 32-0 win. There’s usually no enforced segregation between supporters of opposing fans in Rugby League and I do recall a Wembley Challenge Cup Final in the 1970s which I attended with my wife when some Leeds fans did the same thing against St Helens fans before the stadium was a fully all-seating venue.
This season in the FA Cup Final I witnessed on television some Liverpool fans booing throughout the National Anthem and the playing of ‘Abide with Me’. Whether one is an anti-royalist or an atheist or agnostic such behaviour is unrespectful. Then we had scenes at Huddersfield this week of fans in their excitement running on the pitch after the final whistle, but one was a woman holding a small child goading the Luton supporters. What an example to show a child, and whatever happened to the days when the captain of a winning Rugby Union side used to ask his players for 3 cheers for the losing opponents?
Then last night I heard of a Forest fan running onto the pitch and head butting Billy Sharp who needed stitches for an unwarranted attack.,Every club has a minority of idiots who bring sport into disrepute, and although I understand the euphoria of winning, some behaviour cannot be condoned. Thankfully most Boro fans and the majority of fans generally are more respectful, especially when opposing players are stretched off the field after a nasty injury by showing sympathetic applause. Following the death of favourite players a minute’s clapping is usually the norm, but in my youth a minute’s silence was observed with headgear removed and heads bowed, a much more poignant moment. But that doesn’t happen today because there might be some idiot who wishes to draw attention to himself.
Call me old-fashioned but I also hate sledging in cricket, and it would appear to me that the only competitions where the word ‘sport’ can be truthfully used are snooker and golf where players draw the attention to the referee when they have committed a foul strike or stroke. Perhaps we should invent a new name for competitions and contests, for in my opinion the word ‘sport’ is irrelevant today.
I agree with almost all that you’ve said, Ken, although I reserve the right to believe that if Liverpool fans want to boo the national anthem, then they’re free to do so. I think they made a mistake in booing the hymn (a genuine mistake, because I suspect many thought it was the beginning of GSTQ), although I’m at a loss to see why there is a hymn at the game in any event.
EXMIL CHALLENGE 2022 - Playoff Semifinals- Results
jarkko 8,10,8,9 = 35 v werdermouth 10,9,7,8 = 34
KP in Spain 9,8,8,8 = 33 v Norfolk and Boro 10,9,9,10 = 38
jarkko and Norfolk and Boro will contest the final by the following rules:
1. Predict the halftime score.
2. Predict the final score (including extra time but not penalties).
3. Tiebreak - Predict the time of the first goal.
As in the semi finals, the correct goals per team will score 5 points for both halftime and final score, lose 1 point per goal +/- the actual score. In the event of equal scores, the nearest to the correct time of the first goal will win the final, in the event of that also being tied I will toss a coin to determine the winner. Entries to be posted by 1600hrs 29 May 22.
Good luck to both players.
Come on BORO.
Topic starter May 18, 2022 1:13 pmEXMIL CHALLENGE 2022 - Playoff Semifinals- Results
jarkko 8,10,8,9 = 35 v werdermouth 10,9,7,8 = 34
KP in Spain 9,8,8,8 = 33 v Norfolk and Boro 10,9,9,10 = 38
jarkko and Norfolk and Boro will contest the final by the following rules:
1. Predict the halftime score.
2. Predict the final score (including extra time but not penalties).
3. Tiebreak - Predict the time of the first goal.
As in the semi finals, the correct goals per team will score 5 points for both halftime and final score, lose 1 point per goal +/- the actual score. In the event of equal scores, the nearest to the correct time of the first goal will win the final, in the event of that also being tied I will toss a coin to determine the winner. Entries to be posted by 1600hrs 29 May 22.
Good luck to both players.
Come on BORO.
Well done to Jarkko and Norfolk and Boro. Best of luck to you both for the final. 😎
Well, I am hoping for a Glasgow Rangers famous win tonight.
But at Prime Ministers question time today both Boris and Starmer wished Rangers all the best. Not Glasgow Rangers but just Rangers!
I will be very angry if they have just jinxed the game. Just saying. 🤔