@original-fat-bob. Interesting to hear about your grandson and his apprenticeship as I have a similar experience regarding my two sons.
My eldest went to University but didn't complete the course and is now an MOD Police Officer.
My youngest didn't want to go to uni and took an electrical apprenticeship with Southern Water where he qualified as an Electrical Engineer; after a few years "on the tools" he moved into the management side of the business and has since been headhunted by TfL where he is part of the management team, managing TfL's extensive property portfolio. His salary is more than double that of his brother, added to which he is in a final salary pension scheme.
More evidence that vocational qualifications can take you as far if not further than a university education or as a lower league footballer.
I lived in Farnborough, Hants, for a number of years and watched Farnborough Town play in what was then the Isthmian League and got to know a few of the players quite well. A number in my view were very capable of playing in the EFL and in discussions with them over a pint I raised this prospect with them. I was surprised to find that they were not interested as they all had good jobs and were happy playing as part timers rather than take the risks associated as a full time player in the big leagues. Some had, in fact, been approached by professional clubs but declined to take up their offer.
I suppose it is easy to spot the talent in the lower leagues but not necessarily as easy to persuade them that life as a professional footballer is all rosy and rewarding.
Good luck with your talent spotting 😂😂😎
I liked that comment from Warnock, obviously he now has nothing to do with who we choose to buy, and that is as it should be. Scouting and buying is all important for all clubs. That is how the big clubs operate, and that is how we should run our affairs. Contracts should be fashioned in such a way that the club is never in a corner or held to ransom by players, just copy the Spurs chairman.
I liked that comment from Warnock, obviously he now has nothing to do with who we choose to buy, and that is as it should be. Scouting and buying is all important for all clubs. That is how the big clubs operate, and that is how we should run our affairs. Contracts should be fashioned in such a way that the club is never in a corner or held to ransom by players, just copy the Spurs chairman.
Problem with what Warnock said was how he said it and the implication that there is something somewhat less than harmonious behind the scenes. Normally I would criticise the Club and have a pop at Steve Gibson but in this instance I think the Club have a plan at last and are moving in the right direction with Scott. I do sense that NW isn't a happy bunny, still at least it gives him something else to blame.
My thoughts exactly, RR.
It feels like a multi-faceted attack on the transfer market this summer.
- Firstly, bringing in some ready-made Championship performers that Warnock likes and can help the team immediately (Ikpeazu, Crooks, Lumley).
- Secondly, some squad filler that again Warnock likes and trusts (Peltier, Bamba, Ameobi, Daniels).
- Thirdly, an eye out for younger, cheap, lower league players that again, Warnock likes ("T")
- Finally, some globally-scouted younger players that the club feel will grow and provide potential returns at least (Payero, van Bergen?)
That last point is important, because the club will know that Warnock will not be here for many more seasons and also because it's the area we've really fallen behind in for many a year.
Getting the signings right is the hard part but the strategy looks much better to me, and we're following it seemingly without breaking the bank.
I am also thinking very much along the lines of RR and Andy.
My understanding of the recruitment model that was being operated at Norwich was that the recruitment team did all the leg work and presented options to Daniel Farke, who would have already provided input, but would then be part of the final decision making as to whether or not to recruit; unless I am mistaken, players are not recruited and then just presented to the manager to manage.
As a former manager of teams in the finance industry I certainly would not have been happy had I not been fully involved in the recruitment of personnel who I would eventually be required to develop and manage.
I agree that it appears from NW's comments that in this instance (Van Bergen) NW has not been part of the process for whatever reason; perhaps the club are taking the view that NW will not be with the club beyond this season and as such some of the recruitment is being undertaken with the longer term view in mind or perhaps all is not sweetness and light behind the scenes.
I suspect that despite the new recruitment director being on gardening leave, he has no doubt been sharing his database of prospects with his new employers.
Sadly, despite all the pre-season noise about getting people in early and a full squad hitting the ground running it has not transpired, yet again.
The proposed new recruitment methodology has to be an improvement on what has gone before. My only concern is the time it may take to implement and to bear fruit; I fear that this will result in us being in the Championship for the next 3/5 years as the current squad do not, in my view, have the skill or quality to mount a serious promotion push or to survive in the PL, which surely has to be the aim. 😎
My only other concern to add to yours is whether Warnock will spit his dummy a bit - as it reads like he did when questioned on van Bergen - and not play the guys brought in largely via the recruitment team. If we get to November and Payero is still getting ten minutes here and twenty minutes there, I think we'll have our answer.
Ultimately I'm still happy for one or two non-Warnock players to be brought in if they've got good potential and come at the right price. We have to build for the future and Warnock won't be part of that for too long. It always takes time for players to settle in in any case, just look at Djiksteel and Bola, so bringing these players in now is no bad move even if it's next season, perhaps under a new manager, that we really see what they can do.
My thoughts exactly, RR.
It feels like a multi-faceted attack on the transfer market this summer.
- Firstly, bringing in some ready-made Championship performers that Warnock likes and can help the team immediately (Ikpeazu, Crooks, Lumley).
- Secondly, some squad filler that again Warnock likes and trusts (Peltier, Bamba, Ameobi, Daniels).
- Thirdly, an eye out for younger, cheap, lower league players that again, Warnock likes ("T")
- Finally, some globally-scouted younger players that the club feel will grow and provide potential returns at least (Payero, van Bergen?)
That last point is important, because the club will know that Warnock will not be here for many more seasons and also because it's the area we've really fallen behind in for many a year.
Getting the signings right is the hard part but the strategy looks much better to me, and we're following it seemingly without breaking the bank.
I think that is exactly what is going on. Give Warnock what he needs to get us up there or at least competing rather than being relegated. The one year Bamba/Peltier deals paper overs the cracks in the meantime so Bamba and Peltier will not be hamstringing the next manager with long contracts next summer. The lower league Players are a cheap gamble and if Jones is anything to go by has already paid off handsomely and comfortably cover the ones that don't work out.
Your last point is probably an indication of where we would like to be at some future point with skilled players rather than big lumps. A combination of those and what we already have provides a reasonable base for a new Manager to build from rather than inheriting a squad full of ageing limited cloggers hoofing the ball around.
Fry, Bola, Dijksteel, Jones, Payero, MVB, Sporar and even a few others like Tav, Crooks or maybe even Spence could fit a new style of football and I dare say having Ikpeazu to call on would not be an issue either, certainly compared with Britt, Fletcher and Gestede. Hopefully it breaks the cycle of flip flop management styles.
As a side note, Tottenham could make a move for Barcelona striker Martin Braithwaite before transfer deadline day, according to reports. https://www.football365.com/news/tottenham-line-up-irrefutable-offer-martin-braithwaite-barcelona-middlesbrough
I am afraid Braithwaite won't be a replacement for Kane. Up the Boro!
I think Son is seen as the new number 9. That does leave a space on the left of their front three/four though....
My thoughts exactly, RR.
It feels like a multi-faceted attack on the transfer market this summer.
- Firstly, bringing in some ready-made Championship performers that Warnock likes and can help the team immediately (Ikpeazu, Crooks, Lumley).
- Secondly, some squad filler that again Warnock likes and trusts (Peltier, Bamba, Ameobi, Daniels).
- Thirdly, an eye out for younger, cheap, lower league players that again, Warnock likes ("T")
- Finally, some globally-scouted younger players that the club feel will grow and provide potential returns at least (Payero, van Bergen?)
That last point is important, because the club will know that Warnock will not be here for many more seasons and also because it's the area we've really fallen behind in for many a year.
Getting the signings right is the hard part but the strategy looks much better to me, and we're following it seemingly without breaking the bank.
I think that is exactly what is going on. Give Warnock what he needs to get us up there or at least competing rather than being relegated. The one year Bamba/Peltier deals paper overs the cracks in the meantime so Bamba and Peltier will not be hamstringing the next manager with long contracts next summer. The lower league Players are a cheap gamble and if Jones is anything to go by has already paid off handsomely and comfortably cover the ones that don't work out.
Your last point is probably an indication of where we would like to be at some future point with skilled players rather than big lumps. A combination of those and what we already have provides a reasonable base for a new Manager to build from rather than inheriting a squad full of ageing limited cloggers hoofing the ball around.
Fry, Bola, Dijksteel, Jones, Payero, MVB, Sporar and even a few others like Tav, Crooks or maybe even Spence could fit a new style of football and I dare say having Ikpeazu to call on would not be an issue either, certainly compared with Britt, Fletcher and Gestede. Hopefully it breaks the cycle of flip flop management styles.
The other important piece of the puzzle is the Academy. If they can keep on creating players and generating transfer income we will have the broadest possible base on which to build.
utb
I suspect that despite the new recruitment director being on gardening leave, he has no doubt been sharing his database of prospects with his new employers.
He absolutely shouldn't be. It is highly likely to be part of a condition of his departure from Norwich that he does not share any such information with his new employer prior to the end of the transfer window.
That said, reading between the very obvious lines, there is clearly an agreement of a twin-track strategy which Warnock has agreed to but may not be massively happy with. He has made it clear that players like Lumley, Crooks, Ikpeazu, "T", Bamba, Peltier, Ameobi are players he has taken the lead on signing. Payero and the south American targets seem to have come from Leo. The European mainland signings (van Bergen, Sporar and so on) seem to have come from the recruitment department and Warnock has been very sceptical about former recruitment department signings from mainland Europe (Akpom and Stojanovic come to mind). Noticeable so far that with the exception of Payero, all of the completed signings are definitely Warnock signings.
This year recruitment is more complicated than usual because we have to recruit for both promotion and failure to go up alongside the fact that Warnock will presumably be leaving at the end of the season at the latest.
I don't personally see any change to our recruitment model yet. There is a risk of a worst of both worlds here: we don't recruit enough Warnock players to get promoted the Warnock way but also don't recruit enough non-Warnock players for the next manager. I suspect that the biggest task on Scott's plate when he shows up is succession planning.
I don't personally see any change to our recruitment model yet. There is a risk of a worst of both worlds here: we don't recruit enough Warnock players to get promoted the Warnock way but also don't recruit enough non-Warnock players for the next manager. I suspect that the biggest task on Scott's plate when he shows up is succession planning.
I think the Club have written this year off as a gimme. If NW gets us up then great but the appointment of Scott seems to indicate that a plan is emerging which may take a few years but at least we have a plan instead of knee jerking from one management style to another.
I fully concur that Scott will not be involved in any of the current transfer activity. We can try and start early by predicting what he would maybe target but that's about all.
Many people forget that it took Juninho over 3 months to start and establish himself in the first team. Other players it can take over a season to integrate.
PADDY took over a year to start showing what a good player he is. Britt we are still waiting to see what he could do ???
OFB
Good post Andy and of course there is also an addition to the strategy in that is:
The rationale of developing players we have either purchased in lower leagues or have nurtured from the Academy.
OFB
That little run and pass through to Fjortoft on Juninho's debut wasn't bad!
@andy-r. I agree that if things don't go NW's way that is a distinct possibility.
I posted pre season that if last seasons second half performances continue this season then I can see the Riverside crowd getting on his back and I suspect it won't take much to make him walk.
I truly hope it doesn't happen and that he has a full and probably final season with us, where he can have a good send off and a new era can begin. 😎
I suspect that despite the new recruitment director being on gardening leave, he has no doubt been sharing his database of prospects with his new employers.
He absolutely shouldn't be. It is highly likely to be part of a condition of his departure from Norwich that he does not share any such information with his new employer prior to the end of the transfer window.
I appreciate what the legalities may say but we all know that they are not always adhered to in practice. 😎
I suspect that despite the new recruitment director being on gardening leave, he has no doubt been sharing his database of prospects with his new employers.
He absolutely shouldn't be. It is highly likely to be part of a condition of his departure from Norwich that he does not share any such information with his new employer prior to the end of the transfer window.
I appreciate what the legalities may say but we all know that they are not always adhered to in practice. 😎
With Gibsons's penchant for contract breaches being jumped on I doubt that he would indulge in anything like that. I am sure during a robust interview process that examples and thought processes may have been discussed and that some preparation may be put in place prior to his arrival but I would doubt if any agreement would be breached no matter how tempting.
Don't we have new recruitment person now since Gill departed? I would guess that some if not all credit would be down to them and whoever they work with including Leo for example with South American discussions and even TLF.
I appreciate what the legalities may say but we all know that they are not always adhered to in practice. 😎
I would be really, really surprised if Gibson takes that risk. Plus, Scott may feel that Norwich have treated him fairly. There is really no sign of any of our signings coming from Scott's insider knowledge.
I appreciate what the legalities may say but we all know that they are not always adhered to in practice. 😎
I would be really, really surprised if Gibson takes that risk. Plus, Scott may feel that Norwich have treated him fairly. There is really no sign of any of our signings coming from Scott's insider knowledge.
There may even be some sort of clause in Scott's contract that prevents him from contacting certain Clubs or Players/Agents for 12 months after he leaves Norwich.
I seem to recollect that somewhere on a discussion board (not Dias Boro) that it was mentioned that NW doesn't talk to Neil Bausor now.
Maybe the famous comment by NW " it's nowt to do with me" stems from that perhaps?
I would be reluctant to compare our recruitment record with Spurs. No one, but no one, is signed unless and until the chairman has decided that he is Good enough, and as for the Manager holding forth in public or private? I would fear for him. It is symtematic of our shambolic running of the club that a person who has not covered himself with glory should even dare to comment on our transfer activities. Never forget that he made Britt Captain.
I thought that a couple of our local heroes indulged in a bit of chair throwing (and more)when they would have been better occupied winning a few matches (I think two would have kept us in the Prem). With hindsight it would have been no great disaster to go down with our team, manager, and moral intact. Instead we collapsed like a paper bag, and have not recovered yet!
Derby just announced that they are going into administration.
So does that mean all results are declared null and void and points not gained or lost?
OFB
Shame for the Derby fans but finally Mel couldn't duck and dive any longer. It begs the question would the same have happened to Villa and Leicester etc.if they hadn't been successful in getting promoted. I'm not sure of Forest's predicament but they look to be rocking and I wouldn't be surprised if they are next to start spluttering behind the scenes.
https://www.efl.com/news/2021/september/efl-statement-derby-county2
Derby just announced that they are going into administration.
So does that mean all results are declared null and void and points not gained or lost?
OFB
As far as I know its an automatic 12 point deduction for administration but I think there are more penalties to follow depending on what else comes crawling out of the woodwork.