That article by Scott Wilson read like a bit of a hatchet job on Carrick including blaming him for Giles and Iheanacho with the recruitment team thankfully putting their foot down to keep them as loans rather than permanent signings - that doesn't add up since we were told Iheanacho's wages were way above what Boro could afford as was Giles. I think Len's prediction has already started!
What's the point of a non-disclosure agreement on the departure of Carrick if information such as that is blatantly put into the public domain?
@werdermouth Correct. This is ugly stuff.
Heard on the grapevine that the final straw for Carrick was that Boro are planning to sell HH and are touting him around for highest bids.
MC wanted him to stay but the doe decision had been made so he’d had enough
OFB
It was always going to be so, happened with tav, lath, as has been said it is our business model.
Looks like makems are selling Bellingham and they made it to the land of ambrosia and unicorns.
We will struggle to get near top next season given there are 3 relegated teams, sheff united, Birmingham and possibly Wrexham.
Promotion can be done on a shoe string makems managed it.
Going to try and switch off and enjoy my hols
The Echo article also has a good go at pinning the blame for the long injury list on MC too.
Jarkko, exmil
Thanks for the article. Wilson is adamant that Carrick wanted Iheanacho and wanted a permanent deal, and even says he checked him out with a Man Utd colleague. We’ll never know, of course, but it would be good to know Wilson’s source for this. Surely he wouldn’t just repeat what one person in the club had told him without checking it out against different opinions? That would be both terrible and unethical journalism. What are we to believe?
I also think it unlikely that Gibson would simply pin all the blame on the manager and his coaches after what we understand to be a thorough review. I suspect he’s also too experienced and too shrewd an operator / businessman just to accept at face value the poisoned views or bias of individuals. He and Bausor will know the inner workings of the club backwards: they will be well aware of any major personality clashes and when people are trying to cover their own back by attempting to shift responsibility. Surely he too must have concerns about some of our recruitment?
Yes, I agree, Peter. That stuff about injuries is b**locks.
@clive-hurren I too do not go along with the tales of Carrick controlling the January window transfers, what was the point of employing Scott, Jones etc then giving the power to Carrick to veto the transfers suggested, it would also indicate how weak Scott is for his opinion and judgement to be overlooked.
The other thing that is worrying me is talk of Rob Edward’s is in the frame to replace Carrick, given his association with Scott and Jones, are they going to be running MFC. I really do not trust Scott, I believe he leaks things to Craig Johns, who will print anything to try to make out he is a journalist, to shift any blame away from his door.
Come on BORO.
It is now being reported that Robbie Keane has turned down the chance to be the next Boro manager. I wonder how many people will be left with egg on their face if Carrick becomes the next Bristol City manager and gets them promoted.
Come on BORO.
DONT SHOOT THE MESSENGER PLEASE
I only pass on what I hear if it’s wrong I’m sorry but I was right about Carrick wasn’t I ?
OFB
Still have no idea how it's been suggested a permanent move for Iheanacho was touted given it was reported by Spanish sports newspaper Marca he was earning €4m a year at Seville - it was also claimed that Boro actually paid all his wages for his loan deal at around €2m. In case you're wondering that's 80 grand per week so a permanent deal was never going to happen unless Iheanacho was up for a 75% wage cut. This is simply a nonsense statement that requires only basic fact checking!
Also Ryan Giles was quoted as Hull's highest earner on £35k a week so are we to believe Carrick was pushing to break the bank for these two permanent deals given both players were not even getting much pitch time at their clubs - OK he may have been nostalgic for Giles but given he hardly picked him during his loan spell doesn't suggest Carrick was blind to his form. Even Iheanacho was ultimately dropped once it became apparent that he wasn't match fit or up to speed.
Managers will have some say on who to bring to the club if there are options but I've not heard much in the local press about how Whittaker failed to live up to his billing - or how Carrick rejuvenated Iling-Junior into an effective left-back ahead of Giles who then started to show his quality and confidence. Then there's Sammy Silvera and Micah Hamilton who basically were not of the required level but maybe Carrick wasn't responsible for their arrival...
The problem is we can all hypothesise and speculate as much as we like, but we’ll probably never know the truth of it until Carrick writes his memoirs. I’d pay a lot of money if Steve Gibson were to write his! How are you fixed for an In2View with either or both of these two, OFB?!
Meanwhile rumours will continue to circulate wildly. It’s very unsettling and very distasteful. We can be pretty sure there won’t be any kind of clarification statement coming from Boro. And if our principal source of information remains the local journos, be they in hock to the club or not, then we have little chance of ever getting to know what really went on.
It’s all about the narrative these days aided by proxies in the media - the truth is often just an inconvenience to be brushed aside. You just need enough front to keep it up!
I think all large organisations deal with senior personnel changes in a secretive way. If the CEO of a Bank leaves, we’ll never find out all the decision making factors that led to their dismissal. To expect MFC/SG to make fans completely aware of what’s gone on, is pretty naive - what’s happened, has happened, and we’ll all need to move on.
From a personal point of view, I’m disappointed that MC has gone, either through a mutual agreement or via a sacking, but if it’s gets the fans back on board then maybe it’ll prove to be for the best.
I’ve not got a clue who’d I’d want to be our new manager, but I can see a positive, in that it gets this Forum back on to football and away from the nostalgic ramblings of my Boro childhood. 😉
Despite reports to the contrary, Teesside Live understands that no candidate has yet been offered the role though. Reports on Thursday suggested that former assistant manager Robbie Keane had been offered the role after successful stints in Israel and Hungary, but had turned it down. He’s not even been under consideration at Boro.
Players don’t return for pre-season for another three weeks, so I think we will need to wait at least two to three weeks, before we know who will take over. I think the final decision on Carrick was done late on Tuesday - so there cannot be anyone lined up already now. They might have a list but they will still add to it, too.
So let's take a break and see who we have in mind before the players return for pre-season. Up the Boro!
I've just read an 'new' article in that organ of truth Teesside Live or the 'Teesside Thunderer' that states the obvious and smooths some of the angles out mentioning respect between parties, who's involved in recruitment blah, blah, blah and Mr Scott is heavily involved. No mention of the killer one liner from the tea lady though. I wonder when Mr Edwards will turn up?
UTB,
John
On to the second topic of this thread: Replacement.
I wouldn't back Dyche, the bookies' staunch favourite, with someone else's money.
Dyche is an old school manager who would want to be in command of signings, and some simple phone calls to Warnock, Wilder, Carrick or Woodgate would, one might reasonably assume, soon quash any interest he might have in the job.
The same applies to any experienced independently minded pro.
Since the two chief miscreants in the undercover campaign to defenestrate Carrick will have key roles in recommending the new man, this must surely push Rob (two relegations) Edwards close to the top of the list. He's an old mate of Scott's (and Chris Jones), and was his preferred option last time around.
So I see this- admittedly from a great distance- as being the culmination of a 3 year campaign by Scott to get the coach that he always wanted. And the stars are so aligned that his man is now available and ready to go.
Cue sycophantic Gazette and Echo reports on how this appointment will give Boro fans the more direct style of play they have been asking for, alongside the fact that Edwards took a much less talented squad into the Premier League.
I should say that Edwards seems to be a thoroughly decent man, who is not necessarily wedded to the long ball approach, which seemed best suited to the squad he inherited. He has considerable qualities which may well see him over the line. And it certainly won't hurt him to have his chief advocate on the interviewing panel.
Were I a betting man I think he would be worth putting on a bob or two.
Nevertheless I think his appointment would be a disaster for the Boro, installing a coach who owed his position to one who is himself neither qualified or competent to do his job.
The major obstacle to this scenario might be Steve Gibson's ability to think outside of the box and to come up with a surprise candidate of his own.
I'd like to see him throw a Spaniard (or any other European) in the works
I see that Edwards is now 8/13 fav
So loads of puffery from the local journos this week. I could write it myself in 5 minutes
Some contradictory reports in the media with suggestions Robbie Keane was not approached by Boro but applied for the post but it didn't go any further. Also Cooper has seemingly ruled himself out and Danny Röhl may be problematic with compensation to Wednesday quoted as £5m.
It's being suggested the search has only just started but surely those who will be instrumental in the appointment must have a few people in mind if they opted to part company with Carrick.
Rob Edwards you would think will be someone that ticks the boxes for those making the decision but would his recent record ultimately put Steve Gibson off? OK, relegation from the PL for a promoted club is pretty much par for the course so it probably wouldn't damage him too much but his subsequent record of then taking Luton to 20th in the Championship before his dismissal may make him too risky - plus of course he was sacked by Watford after joining from Forest Green after only 10 games after a poor start. Perhaps too many question marks on his record to make it a safe choice for Steve Gibson.
Maybe somebody with a bit more experience and possibly more technical who is used to working under a Director of Football would be the requirement - otherwise you could imagine that another young manager who could be easily controlled would certainly be appealing for some within the club.
The England men’s under-21 squad has been named for this summer’s UEFA U21 EURO Finals in Slovakia.
Head coach Lee Carsley has picked a 23-man group an it includes Hayden Hackney and our former loanee Sam Iling Jnr (Aston Villa), too.
Liam Delap has not been selected in England's Under-21 squad for this month, though. The 22-year-old has just completed a £30m move from Ipswich to Chelsea.
Well done, Hayden. Up the Boro!
Some contradictory reports in the media with suggestions Robbie Keane was not approached by Boro but applied for the post but it didn't go any further. Also Cooper has seemingly ruled himself out and Danny Röhl may be problematic with compensation to Wednesday quoted as £5m.
It's being suggested the search has only just started but surely those who will be instrumental in the appointment must have a few people in mind if they opted to part company with Carrick.
Rob Edwards you would think will be someone that ticks the boxes for those making the decision but would his recent record ultimately put Steve Gibson off? OK, relegation from the PL for a promoted club is pretty much par for the course so it probably wouldn't damage him too much but his subsequent record of then taking Luton to 20th in the Championship before his dismissal may make him too risky - plus of course he was sacked by Watford after joining from Forest Green after only 10 games after a poor start. Perhaps too many question marks on his record to make it a safe choice for Steve Gibson.
Maybe somebody with a bit more experience and possibly more technical who is used to working under a Director of Football would be the requirement - otherwise you could imagine that another young manager who could be easily controlled would certainly be appealing for some within the club.
OFB I wasn’t shooting the messenger, the point I made was that if he walked instead of being sacked, the compensation would be less (if any). As far as the news that Carrick had been sacked we all got it at the same time, some quicker on the keyboard than others, in fact Teesside Live were still reporting that the word out of the club was that he would be there for pre season 😱. No offence meant.DONT SHOOT THE MESSENGER PLEASE
I only pass on what I hear if it’s wrong I’m sorry but I was right about Carrick wasn’t I ?
OFB
Come on BORO.
Craig Johns wrote about tBoroo's head coach model and how attractive it would be for an aplicant.
"What should be stressed though is that Scott is on record as saying he would never sign a player without the approval of the head coach. The way it worked with Carrick was that meetings to plan a window would take place and Scott and the recruitment team were told what kind of players were wanted - so for example, ‘this summer we need a defensive-minded midfielder who is strong and athletic’.
"The recruitment team would come up with three or four options they felt suited that mould of player, present them to Carrick, and there would be discussions between Carrick, recruitment team and Steve Gibson/Neil Bausor over who to target, in what order. That’s likely to continue.
"Put simply, if any potential candidate isn’t willing to work under that structure, they’re not just ruling themselves out of the Boro job, but almost every job in the Championship and above. The clubs who don’t operate with similar models now are virtually zero."
So the tranfers are always a team work. Up the Boro!
Regarding the new coach there doesn’t appear to be a stand out person who we would all say “yes, I’d love it if he came”.
Forgetting who’s available, ie unemployed without a job, are there any other managers we could become a bit more excited about ?
For what it’s worth I’ve always liked the Ipswich manager - 2 consecutive promotions playing attacking football and a decent showing in the Premier League albeit they were always a favourite to be relegated.
Philip of Huddersfield
ps my final thoughts on Carrick was that he seemed a very genuine guy, very much liked and respected by his players, he was the reason why young players chose Boro, he improved young players and when the team played successfully as he wanted them to do then Boro were good to watch and scored many goals. The downside was that he didn’t seem to have a tough streak in him and , as many of us have said, he didn’t have a plan B or plan C when the game wasn’t going as planned. I wouldn’t be surprised if he achieved success at another Club and feel that his coaching and style of play would better suit a Premiership team where the players are much better than Boro players.
👍🤔🤔
Well that's put the cat among the pigeons, just like the previous two coaches, Scott wins the power struggle.although Carrick was on the ropes.
Now what happens with new players going forward , during interviews Scott will obviously put forward names , and then the new guy ,will have to go along with the choices , that could be a sticking point.
The real issue is whose out there , I hope it's not someone like Challinor ex Pools, might as well go for Graham Lee , knowing Gibson he prefers rookies,
I think what the guy did at Oxford was remarkable considering were they where and his budget, however maybe it's time to look abroad, someone from an established successful club, maybe an assistant from within whose well thought of.
Better be soon though
@peter-surtees The only caveat was the injuries sustained in training. It would be interesting to see the actual numbers sustained in game time.
The issue for me was the time out from the injury date. How many times did we hear, it’s a knock. Then something else not disclosed. Remember McGree, I think it was. Back for Christmas and not seen until playing for Australia in reality.
There always appeared to be smoke and mirrors over the real state of a player, with MC having to give a non message at presser’s.
Like the Recruitment in January, I guess we will never know. What we do believe on this blog, was that MFC were never ever going to sign Inheancho or even Giles due to there outstanding contracts and wages. Then of course, there were their abysmal performances. Carrick wanting to sign them permanently, now that is a big fib.
As we are talking Managers / Coaches, here is a link to ALL the ones that have been at MFC since 1889.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Middlesbrough_F.C._managers
Of course with promotion the aim for the gold at the end of the rainbow, it is interesting to remind ourselves and see the performances of those from Aitor Karanka through to the Michael Carrick and the present day.
Whilst MC has the highest win ratio at 50%, I think that AK with only 49 losses overall including a season in the EPL is arguably better.
Carrick to Spurs? Would you bet against it?
Probably a long shot given spurs qualified for Champions League - sounds like Thomas Franks is their preferred option after several successful PL seasons but it will cost to take him from Brentford - Carrick to Brentford maybe? Unless Steve Cooper is holding out for that one…