I see the EG are now carrying this story! 😎Sounded more like throwaway soundbites from messrs Shearer and Lineker who only mention Carrick was regarded as one of the best coaches outside the PL but maybe with Boro being bottom of the league that's no longer true.
"You saw it here first" 😉I see the EG are now carrying this story! 😎Sounded more like throwaway soundbites from messrs Shearer and Lineker who only mention Carrick was regarded as one of the best coaches outside the PL but maybe with Boro being bottom of the league that's no longer true.
The headline to the Gazette article should have read;
"Sports Editor Copies, Pastes and Gets Paid".
Thanks for the brilliant opener, Selwynoz - a really interesting read that I thoroughly enjoyed.
As a slight aside, I just want to say how pleased I am as a reader with all the new openers we've had this season. It was obviously a bit of shift from one writer (Werder) or just OFB and I but I have to say I think it's been fantastic for the blog to have so many slightly different flavours of a preview. All of them have been great in different ways.
As for Saturday, I think Bangura's injury, and the distinctly different performances of Engel and Jones against Sheff Wed may have created a bit of an unexpected lightbulb moment for Carrick and co.
Clearly Carrick wants to play with one fullback high and wide as he did all last season with Giles. Engel was obviously signed to do that job and but when he looked shaky with Coulson previously unconvincing we went back in for Bangura. Now it seems that the answer may just have been Jones on the other side all along.
It's uncomfortable to think of Jones as a fullback but of course Carrick doesn't play him there anyway - like Giles last year, Jones was deployed very high and very wide like a winger in the week, albeit one who looks to get around the back rather than sling crosses in. it looked like a big step forward for 30 - 35 mins and I think, if we're not going to change shape/tactics, that might be the answer, at least in the short term.
If that is the case, then the left back essentially becomes the left side of a back three. Van den Berg did an admirable job but I don't think he's the right answer there. In theory Clarke should be perfect for it - he was signed for that role by Wilder after all - but whilst he's unavailable I'd probably go for McNair.
Regular readers will know that I'm not Paddy's biggest fan but he did have his best spell for us playing on the left of a back three, and is considerably better on the ball than RvdB.
I would also switch Lenihan and Fry around, so that Fry is the left-sided centre-back and Lenihan is right-sided. With Jones pushed high, Fry would have to cover behind him and I just don't think he ever looks comfortable on the flanks. He's much assured centrally so I'd switch him and have Lenihan covering the right flank as Jones attacks, with Fry in his more accustomed position.
Hackney and O'Brien are reasonably obvious in centre midfield despite the other options available. Then, if fit, I would play Forss wide left and McGree wide right.
I've mentioned before that I'd like to see Forss wide left as a sort of Championship Marcus Rashford, driving inside and getting shots off. I see that suiting him far more than coming off the right. McGree would be well suited to the right side as he drifts inside to leave space for Jones, using his one-touch passing skills to help get Jones away behind the opposition defensive line.
That leaves the no. 10 and striker spots. Perhaps controversially, I'd give Crooks and Coburn another go. Crooks has regressed under Carrick and isn't a natural no. 10 but he's also linked well with Jones in the past and has proved he can get goals. Coburn still looks our best finisher alongside Forss.
So I think that might be the best way to our three likeliest goalscorers (Coburn, Forss, Crooks) and our three likeliest creators (McGree, Jones, Hackney) into Carrick's 4-2-3-1 setup.
-----------Dieng-----------
Jones Lenihan Fry McNair
-----Hackney O'Brien-----
--McGree Crooks Forss---
-----------Coburn---------
If Bangura is fit, or Forss isn't, that might change the equation a bit but I think (hope) there's some logic to the above.
@Andy R
really Interesting team selection. I think that a strong left sided central defender will make a big difference in a back three and I was happy to see that Clarke got 45 minutes with the U21s midweek. Could be a turning point if we get a good 3-4-3 going. Jones at right wing back. Left wingback could be an issue. Bangura is the obvious choice but maybe even Engel could work if he wasn't exposed as a fullback. I'd prefer McGree as wide left and he could look after Engel a bit. Forss would be the obvious choice for wide right but he is injured and so the wide right is open. Maybe Jones plays there and McNair, Dijksteel or Smith plays right wing back. Either way, it seems a more coherent team.
Thanks to everyone for the kind comments about the opener. I had good fun following the story down that rabbit hole.
UTB
Supplementary to the above, it's quite telling that of the dozen or so summer signings, only two make my XI using Carrick's tactics:
- Dieng - a default choice given that last year's keepers were cleared out
- O'Brien - a loan signing
Both have plenty of Championship experience.
Perhaps Carrick should go with it just to show Scott what he really thinks!
@andy-r. It is an option but one that causes me some concerns.
Jones has to start but I am not comfortable with his defensive responsibilities, his tackling can be suspect and he is inclined to give free kicks away in dangerous positions. He was only on a few minutes on Tuesday and managed to get himself booked following a clumsy challenge.
Play him high and wide with a relatively solid and experienced defender in the role, like Smith, behind him.
McNair could and has done a job on the left before so I would go with that.
My concerns about switching Fry are that he has been played as the LCB before and was decidedly uncomfortable in that position so your suggestion potentially solves one problem but could create another.
I have never been convinced by this trend of playing lefties on the right and righties on the left as they can often be nullified by defenders pushing them onto their weaker sides. I prefer horses for courses but with the flexibility of being able to switch, if needed, for periods during a game. Too many changes of this nature could create even greater problems when players are not on their natural side of the pitch and we have enough problems already to deal with, so I am not in favour.
I would play McGree behind the main striker with the freedom to roam across the pitch.
I still can’t understand why, given our shortage of goals, that Forss hasn’t been played as the main striker.
Engel is available so why not play him wide on the left ahead of McNair. All the videos I saw of him were exactly in that role, making crosses and goals and not as a back four player. Another example of players being recruited but then not played to their strengths.
We as supporters could debate this all day and would come up with endless permutations but it is down to MC to try and find the right combination of players and a system which suits their abilities; the jury is still out and the executioner hovers in the background.
Here’s hoping he can find the solution very soon. 😎
I don't disagree with any of that, KP.
If I were Carrick, I'd be switching the system pretty sharpish and not playing his 4-2-3-1 because I don't think it's makes the best use of the resources available to him any more.
What I was trying to put across is that if Carrick is determined to play the same shape and tactics that he always has, the XI I've suggested might work better.
It's funny that he said he now has options to play in different ways, yet despite it not working, he's stuck to his formula even after the international break.
Great debate guys
@andy-r. “It's funny that he said he now has options to play in different ways, yet despite it not working, he's stuck to his formula even after the international break.”
Exactly, that’s partially what is perplexing me about him at the moment and the fact he appears reluctant to play some players in their best/more familiar positions.
It will be interesting to see how he sets up Saturday and how quickly he can settle on a first eleven, something he did for the majority of last year, injuries and suspension permitting. 😎
@andy and @kp. Two very well reasoned posts. Given the issues we have there are a couple of compromises that stand out.
Of the back three CB’s including McNair, none are left footed. Fry can only stand on his right leg, McNair not much better, but can pass the ball. Lenihan is the only one who can and does use his left foot.
if we go with a three, then we rally do need to protect them down the flanks. Jones can get back even when high up, because of his pace. On the left, we really do not have any pace at the moment. Maybe Barguna will provide that, but is injured.
We are picking up a few injuries now, and Forss is the biggest loss. I have not included Clarke as it has been a year out.
MC will have to compromise and for me that is protecting the defence with Hackney and O’Brien. With the places and players left, we need as much pace, creativity and possible goal scoring as possible.
McGree at 10. After that, it is who is available and is the more experienced in keeping their heads up. As much as his limitations, that is possibly Crooks?
Many thanks for a really interesting opener, Selwynoz.
A very interesting debate, lads. One player who wasn’t mentioned by anybody was Howson. Do we think that he is no longer a first team fixture? I would hate to think of him languishing on the bench just yet, because I think he still has lots to offer, even if he no longer has pace. It clearly didn’t work at Blackburn keeping him in the side when MC attempted to play both Jonny and O’Brien together, which of course meant having to push O’Brien wide left. Can we see Howson in another role anywhere? He has played of necessity in central defence in the past, and didn’t do a bad job. Can you see him playing as right back in a four? He lacks pace, as I say, but can defend and is still able to drive forward and pinpoint good balls to the front runners. What do you think?
Re the Southampton game: given the relative situations of the two clubs and Boro’s very poor form, you might normally expect us to lose this one. Saints are, of course, one of the favourites for promotion. However, they’ve suffered three losses on the trot, though all to high-flying sides, so now might be a good time to play them. Typical Boro would see us beating the Saints unexpectedly. I doubt it personally, but you never know. Perhaps we might take an unexpected lead and then hang on to it via our fingernails? As Jimmy Greaves used to say, it’s a funny old game, Saint(s). It will take something like that and a battling performance to defend a lead to give us some much-needed confidence and to keep the fans onside. Let’s hope it happens.
Even if we do pull off a stunning, against-all-odds win, though, my concern, echoing what Dormo said earlier, would be that we don’t have the strength of squad to maintain a winning or unbeaten streak over several games. I hope I’m wrong, but I can see us winning the odd game here and there, but then lapsing into further careless defeats. If I’m right, it threatens to be a long and difficult season. I just hopes Carrick soon finds his mojo again and gets us playing well and picking up enough points to reach mid-table security.
it is exactly in this situation that you need a wise old head at MC's side encouraging him that it is ok to relegate your preferred style of play to something a little more pragmatic for fear of relegating your team instead.@andy-r. “It's funny that he said he now has options to play in different ways, yet despite it not working, he's stuck to his formula even after the international break.”
Exactly, that’s partially what is perplexing me about him at the moment and the fact he appears reluctant to play some players in their best/more familiar positions.
It will be interesting to see how he sets up Saturday and how quickly he can settle on a first eleven, something he did for the majority of last year, injuries and suspension permitting. 😎
Who could be our latter day Terry Venables today?
Tough to think of anyone but Chris Hughton is currently managing Ghana and might be available on a part-time basis. Presumably he knows Carrick from their Spurs days.
I'm not really in favour of such an arrangement though as it undermines the Head Coach without any guarantee of success.
Hi all, KEN’S FUNERAL ARRANGEMENTS
Tuesday 3 October at Zetland Park Methodist Church, Redcar TS10 3AU
Followed by Kirkleatham Crematorium TS11 8HH
Then reception in walled garden.
Thanks, Philip
@philip-of-huddersfield. Boro play Cardiff at the Riverside that evening.
It would be nice if MFC or Radio Tees could pay a tribute to Ken either before the game or at half time. 😎
Thanks for letting us know about this - despite never having met Ken, I know he was one on life’s good men and had I not been abroad on the day, then I would have attended.
A win on the day will be a fitting tribute and I know you will update us on how the service went.
I can see what you mean about Howson- he and McNair did pretty well when they were forced into playing at the back.
Maybe a back three of Lenihan Fry and Howson with Wing backs of Jones and, dare I say it, Engels with O Brien Hackney and McGree couldn’t be a bad start- as for the other 2 Coburn/Latte and Forss/Rogers
Thanks for sharing details for Ken's funeral Philip. I don't suppose you know if the service is being streamed as I would take the time out from work to "be there" virtually.
If not, I will find and read a poem he can take with him on his way.
ref your post
As a slight aside, I just want to say how pleased I am as a reader with all the new openers we've had this season. It was obviously a bit of shift from one writer (Werder) or just OFB and I but I have to say I think it's been fantastic for the blog to have so many slightly different flavours of a preview. All of them have been great in different ways.
I totally agree that the shift this season to other contributors for the opening leader posts has galvanised this blog.
It has produced interesting points for discussion with varied views and it has opened up various avenues that we, (you and I) would never have considered!
I’m quite confident that all the other posters will be of a similar high standard as can be seen from their previous posts and comments on this blog.
Many thanks to you Andy for sharing the load last season you’re a star man!
Well done Diasborians May this blog last forever !
OFB
@original-fat-bob Agreed. I am really enjoying all the different takes by thread openers.
A lot more than I am enjoying the football.
I'll get a chance to actually listen on audio tomorrow. I feel like I should do penance by doing so.
In the press conference, Carrick said
It's definitely not rip it up and start again.
I can't say I agree but I do respect his stance. I think he's wrong but he's set out his stall to play football a certain way and not wavered from that. In interview after interview he's said the same thing and, notably, hasn't put the blame on anyone. Always supported his players. Never reached for excuses.
If he can turn this around, I think he will prove to be a manager in the same mould as Southgate and just as capable. I really hope that happens but I think he's made the wrong choices. You need two things as a manager; to be able to manage players as people and to make more right choices than wrong ones.
I don't know what we will do tomorrow. I'm assuming Carrick will stick with 4-2-3-1 but tweak how he works it. We may see him reverting to the lop-sided formation he used last season with Jones acting as the wing-back while the left back stays home. Probably though he'll try to pack as much defensive solidity in as he can because we absolutely can't afford to go behind again.
If I had to pick the team and had to play 4-2-3-1 then I would go with a mirror image of last season's approach.
Dieng
Jones - Fry - Lenihan - whoever is fit
Hackney - O'Brien
Forss (if fit)/Rogers - Lath - McGree
Coburn
McGree is one of those players who takes a few matches to get up to speed. Lath is struggling with finishing but playing him a bit deeper to make use of his energy may work ok. If Forss isn't fit, I would be tempted to swap McGree and Rogers around.
Left to myself, I would set us up as a high-pressing 4-3-3.
As for the match tomorrow. We have to win sometime but I don't see any progression in our performances to indicate that we are improving in a way that means we would expect to win the match on merit. We might win through very good luck or Southampton just imploding but I think Southampton have already had their implosion. Best I can see is another 1-1 draw with both teams trying to take no risk.
Heard a rumour that McGree and Carrick fell out because MC wanted him to play at full back and he refused because he thought it might affect his international place.
In my book you play where you’re told as the club (fans!) pay your wages!
OFB
Tomorrow ???
I’m going for the 👁️ 👁️ eyeballs 👀 in the sky again !
1-1 and I’ll be there !
OFB
I forgot to mention in an earlier post that Tuesday clearly demonstrated our need for a vociferous and strong player on the field to take charge when things are not working.
Engel did not cover himself in glory but neither did a number of team mates who failed to support him; he was left time and time again in 1:1 situations with the wing back given acres of space to be able to run into. This should have been nipped in the bud early on.
What would we give for a certain Mr Boam or Mr Souness to roast a few players and get it sorted; those were the days. 😎
@original-fat-bob. Definitely, one of the best leaders/Captains we have had in recent years.
I think the current crop are all too nice because they have never really had anything to fight for in their short pampered lives.😎
@powmillnaemore hi, I’m not aware it is being streamed. But I very much doubt it.
philip
As a rumour it probably doesn't make sense as since Boro have signed two left full-backs this summer it would only have been a one-off selection to play him as left full-back and McGree probably wouldn't have made a big deal about it.
I think more possible is that in the summer it was rumoured McGree had offers for a move but it was ruled out by the club. McGree hasn't really started all season and Carrick would be mad if he's going to keep him on the fringe of the first team to prove a point - though given he started against Sheff Wed then he's no longer on the naughty step but was the first player subbed I think.
A lot has been said about the great players that we have lost since last season, but I think there's another list of players who we are also missing. We used to have Howson 8, McGree 8, Forss 8, Fry 7, Lenihan 8, McNair 7 etc. They didn't play every week, but according to the Teesside Live player ratings they turned up pretty often. Now they have been replaced with the likes of Howson 5, McGree 5, Forss 5, Fry 4, Lenihan 6, McNair 4, if they even get to play at all. Curiously, the former lot only started to make regular appearances last season after Chris Wilder left.
It puts me in mind of Dumbo and his magic feather. It was empirically true that, with those huge ears, he could definitely fly. But once he let the magic feather slip from his trunk, he no longer believed that he could do it, and he started to plummet. Confidence is such a crucial part of all sports and in football seems to be especially graphic when loss of confidence across several players can have a multiplying effect and also seems to be contagious.
We can all recall the sight of McGree 9, scoring with that incredible scissors kick at Norwich, while he was holding the feather. The Riley McGree that used to play for Chris Wilder could never have done that and I don't think that the current incarnation of him could do it either.
I think that when we're forming our opinions of the new crop of incomers we should bear this in mind. We've all seen last year's players performing with full confidence, we know that they can be exceptionally good and, perhaps cut them a little bit of slack because of that. Not only do the new players not have the feather themselves, but they're playing alongside incumbent players whose confidence is also currently shot to pieces.
I imagine that Michael Carrick is currently looking for the feather down the back of the settee, and is probably pretty sure that he brought it with him when arrived at Middlesbrough. If it turns up, maybe as a result of a fluke early goal or some other random event, we may get the chance to see what the new players can do when they too feel the uplifting effect of that elusive confidence. It might even turn out that one or two of them are not that bad.
Our free-scoring team has also been replaced by Boro-nil 😉