Championship 2019-20: Weeks 16-17
Sun 24 Nov – 12:00: Boro v Hull City
Wed 27 Nov – 19:45: Boro v Barnsley
Sat 30 Nov – 15:00: Leeds v Boro
Jonathan Woodgate may well be tempted to put his head in his hands as we enter a crucial last week of November that desperately needs to see an end to an uninspiring sequence of nine games without victory. It’s been recurring nightmare run of results that would possibly even make one notorious anhidrosis suffering member of the royal family wake up in a cold sweat. Although, whilst the non-perspiring prince was ridiculed as the Duke of Porkies for claims his medical condition was induced by an adrenaline overdose when serving in the Falklands, few visitors to the Riverside have experienced anything remotely described as an adrenaline rush in recent months. Indeed, the last time Boro actually won a game was back in mid September when supporters on the terraces basked in 20-degree plus temperatures as they were made to sweat by those other more honest Royals of Reading as their team hung on to their 1-0 lead thanks to some late heroics by Randolph.
Despite a distinct lack of home comforts this season, there has been no shortage of home truths being vented by disgruntled Boro followers after they have witnessed just five goals in eight Riverside games. Woodgate’s initial attempts to switch to a more expansive game have left Boro as the lowest scorers in the Championship and have so far failed to inspire confidence that the club is building that much promised exciting future that was mentioned in the summer. As many choose to raise their doubts about their new head coach on social media, it seems he’s not minded to read their unsupportive offerings. Speaking after the relative goal-fest at QPR, which ended the run of four games without scoring, the Boro head coach declared that the ‘real fans’ (as he calls them) are behind him and his players: “We were getting beat and they were shouting my name. It’s fantastic. It’s brilliant.” – though still no credible evidence to suggest his name was followed by the word ‘out’.
Nevertheless, Woodgate is convinced that it’s just a small mainly anonymous minority who aren’t behind him and the team: “The players are not getting booed, I’m not getting booed. Okay, social media has the odd thing, but you get on with that.” Indeed, he even suspects that those “odd” comments that take aim on Twitter may not even be from Boro fans: “How do you know who they are on social media? They could be Newcastle fans, Sunderland fans, Hartlepool fans, we don’t know who they are, do we? Keyboard warriors?” He may be right as no doubt there must be plenty of Mackems out there getting quite irate at the growing prospect of having to face Boro in League One next season – especially after all the trouble the Wearsiders have taken in avoiding the fixture in recent years.
Labelling those who simply post aggressive ramblings directed personally at the Boro head coach as keyboard warriors possibly elevates them to something more noble. Though surprisingly the actually phrase ‘keyboard warrior’ was first coined in 2014 by the People’s Daily in China to describe the social media response aimed against bystanders who failed to intervene to help a woman who was beaten to death at a McDonald’s restaurant in the Shandong Province.
For those who only normally read the sport’s section of the People’s Daily it was a cautionary tale of blind faith that left Wu Shuoyan as the unfortunate victim of a brutal attack by members of a religious cult called the Church of Almighty God for declining to hand over her mobile phone number so she could be further contacted by the group. Followers were told that as long as they gave donations, the ‘Almighty God’ would keep their illness at bay but Wu’s public refusal saw her denounced as an “evil spirit” by the group, who they later insisted was trying to suck away their life energy and could only be stopped by being killed.
Incidentally, the cult, also known as Eastern Lightening, has according to the Beijing government several million followers who believe that Jesus has been resurrected as a Chinese woman. That woman was discovered to be Yang Xiangbin, who as luck would have it happened to be the wife of the sect’s founder Zhao Weishan – unfortunately the couple had to flee to the United States in 2000 after denouncing the Chinese state as the “evil red dragon” before sadly failing to see their millennialist prophecy of the destruction of the world come to pass – though it’s hard to imagine what people said to cheer them up when it didn’t happen.
They have subsequently claimed in exile that the McDonald’s incident was carried out by a splinter group that comprised mainly of an unemployed textile worker Zhang Lidong and his extended family, who argued that it was they that had the true ‘Two Witnesses’ among them after usurping the claims of another couple from Inner Mongolia. It then got a bit Pythonesque when they claimed that Zhao’s sect are fake ‘Almighty God’, while they were the real ‘Almighty God’, which could possibly be another one for factcheckUK to clear up. However, it’s possible that Zhang and his daughter Zhang Fan already know if they are the real ‘Almighty God’ as they were tried and executed for their crime.
Anyway, after that all too brief delve into the somewhat murky origins of keyboard warriors, I suspect it has possibly raised more questions than it answered. Indeed, what about the cult of North-East Lightening and why has it failed to strike more than once at the Riverside this season. Plus are Woody and Keano really the true two witnesses who can shed light on the matter? if so, what have they seen that we haven’t and should they even be considered reliable witnesses? OK, any form of divine intervention is probably a long shot for the Boro faithful at this moment but no doubt many men on Teesside will at least sympathise with the delicate problem of having a wife who many believe to be all powerful – even if she’s prone to expecting miracles instead of producing them.
Right now the issue of belief for supporters is one that has been stretched by Boro’s failure to win games and is surely not something that can continue indefinitely. With two home games in the space of four days, it would perhaps reach breaking point if the run without three points continued into December – especially given that one of the upcoming games is against the bottom club. Granted, Boro put in a much better display at Loftus Road but it still didn’t conclude in victory and QPR were their usual poor selves defensively. Nevertheless, at least Britt took his goals well and that is at least a welcome sign given many were struggling to think where Boro’s next goal was coming from. Woodgate’s team have only been averaging around two-thirds of a goal per game, so to score two was actually three game’s worth in one afternoon.
Whether the return to scoring ways will attract the supporters back to the Riverside for Sunday lunchtime’s TV games is difficult to say. Demand to watch the Boro on Teesside has started to wane in recent weeks and that may be a factor in how long Steve Gibson is prepared to allow Woodgate to find his feet – albeit without a gun in his hand. The Boro chairman must have looked on in envy at Kosovo during the international break as there were 300,000 applications for tickets for their game against England with seats for only 13,500 available. One Kosovo supporter was so desperate for a ticket he even offered a kidney in exchange on Facebook. Whether anyone on Teesside would be prepared to offer their kidney for a seat at the Riverside this weekend is unlikely – especially as both will probably be needed to work overtime as sorrows are regularly anticipated being drowned in post-match therapy.
Incidentally, a recent survey found that the average drinker will spend £38,000 on pints of beer in their lifetime, which doesn’t sound like much of a budget for anyone who followers a football team. A quick back-of-the-beer-mat calculation may expose that figure as a little lightweight as the survey also quoted the price of the average pint at £3.61 – which if you consider average life expectancy is just over 80, then it should give you a good 60 years of drinking. So by my reckoning that equates to just under three-and-a-half pints per week, which surely goes to prove why the glass of a Boro supporter on a daily basis is generally only half full – or is that half empty?
Anyway, as far as football is concerned, it’s been a long time since anyone raised a glass in celebration on Teesside. This Sunday sees Hull City arrive at the Riverside as Woodgate seeks victory in front of the cameras. The Tigers took the textbook step of appointing a 39-year old as head coach this summer with the former Northern Ireland midfielder Grant McCann. Incidentally, he made his professional league debut in 2001 for West Ham in a 2-1 defeat at the Riverside. Although, unlike Woodgate, Hull is not McCann’s first managerial post as he started out as a number one at Peterborough in the summer of 2016, before being dismissed at the end of February 2018 after a run of seven games (not even nine) without a win. His next post was at Doncaster, where he took them into the play-offs last season but lost out against Charlton and was then appointed as the Tiger’s head coach.
Hull had a slow start to their campaign with just one win in the opening six fixtures but their last ten games have seen steady form with 17 points gained from a possible 30. Indeed, the recent form of McCann’s team saw them beat Forest, Derby and Fulham before losing narrowly 1-0 against leaders West Brom last time out. It suggests that Boro will need to play well to get anything from Sunday’s game and it’s perhaps not a fixture that Woodgate’s team will easily get three points from.
Much will depend on the team’s performance this weekend and defeat would undo any minor momentum gained in that comeback against the Hoops. At least the return of George Friend and Darren Randolph gave the Boro head coach a stronger looking defence but it still resulted in avoidable goals being conceded. Friend’s return allowed McNair to move back into midfield where he has been the main driving force and hopefully he’ll not be needed in a back three for some time. There seems to still be a problem of balance in the team as clean sheets come at the expense of not scoring and a more potent attack has usually resulted in goals being conceded – the three occasions this term when Boro have scored more than once in a game have been the 3-3 at Luton, the 2-2 at Bristol and the 2-2 at QPR. Somehow Boro need to find a way of scoring against opposition who don’t play so open or at least stopping those teams from scoring too.
Whatever the outcome on Sunday, the following game against Barnsley is surely a must win. If Boro can’t beat a team that have only picked up just two points on their travels this season then the game is surely up. OK, the cliche often quoted is that there are no easy games in the Championship but it would be hard to see how Woodgate can turn things around if he can’t pick up three points on Wednesday. The Tykes have just appointed the 42-year old Austrian Gerhard Struber as manager, who last season finished third in the Austrian top tier with Wolfsberger. He’s reportedly built his reputation on developing players and is known for his tactical approach to the game – perhaps Steve Gibson should make a mental note. At least playing Barnsley next week before he’s had much chance to work with his players may be for the best – though the worry is that it’s yet another team in the relegation pack that have made a managerial appointment with a view to escaping the drop zone.
Those two home games are then followed by a trip to Elland Road for the non-derby, where automatic promotion hopefuls Leeds have lost only once this season. Marcelo Bielsa team have built their challenge on a solid defence and have yet to enter double figured for goals conceded. It’s game between the Championship’s meanest defence and the team with worst attack in Boro – so it’s hard to see Woodgate getting much joy when he returns to his old club. Of course, there will be some talk of Patrick Bamford but the latest transfer rumours have seen the name of Dani Ayala possibly being the subject of bid by the West Yorkshire club in January. Boro’s Spanish stopper (as the local press would say) is out of contract in the summer but has been offered a new contract on reduced terms. As we know money talks louder than sentiment in football and at 28 he probably still has one decent contract left in his career, which may well be away from Teesside if his agent does some touting around.
In truth, the economics at Boro mean that key players will leave and that’s probably more likely if the club are struggling against relegation to League One. As ever it won’t be the players we want to get rid of that will attract offers in January and Paddy McNair will have already caught the eye of those club seeking to bolster their promotion squads. Indeed, the consequence of our current bad run is that the club may find it difficult to refuse any decent offers in January, while simultaneously becoming a less attractive option for targets who can add quality to the team.
Boro are literally in a no-win situation where it appears the only solution is to start winning games and begin climbing the table – Even Jonathan Woodgate is clear that now is the time to start winning and has said so: “We have to start winning games and there is no getting away from that.” He also thanked the fans for their patience but in truth what real choice is there but to sit and wait patiently given there’s little indication from anyone at the club that they are contemplating a change. It’s bit like one of those delayed train announcements by the driver that ends shortly before arriving at the destination with “sorry for any inconvenience caused” – in that sense supporters are simply like passengers trapped on a slow-moving train with no option to change and can only post their displeasure on social media. Only it seems Boro’s season was derailed before it left the station and now we’re quickly running out of track.
Werder,
As always excellent but like the match reports the truth and reality hurts. Boro will I fear be found wanting yet again. We have a manager who isn’t yet a manager he just seems to pick a team.
It beggars belief that Mr Pulis’ team seems to have been free-scoring but maybe that’s looking at the subject through the bottom of another empty beer glass.
UTB,
John
Thanks John and I suspect it’s do or die time for Woodgate as his positiion will become untenable if Boro going into December without a win in 12. Although, I can only really see the Barnsley game as an opportunity for three points so I think the club will just continue to drift along.
btw it sounds like you’ve got beer goggles on if you’re beginning to see the expansive beautiful game through the eyes on Tony Pulis – the question is will he be back before Christmas with an old school ho ho ho…
Thanks Werder. I think this blog is more full of Keyboard Worriers than Warriors.
Boro 2-1 Hull
Cheers Andy, I’m often worried what my keyboard will write next…
Quite a superb article Werder. Well done.
I must say that I found the history of Chinese keyboard warriors a little tragic, but amusing all the same. Not quite the same as following Boro this season so far. Tragic yes, but amusing no.
As for your linking post at the end of the previous thread. Any prose that includes the words Riding, Yorkshire and South is clearly nothing but fiction
A little like the notion Boro could get three points from the next three fixtures.
I see Hull being too good for us ion Sunday; scraping a hard earned point against Barnsley; and being on the wrong end of a severe drubbing at Elland Road. (And that is me with my £3.61’s worth half full !!)… Mind you, you only get half full for £3.61 in a lot of places these days…..
Thanks Powmill and after reading the whole story of what was behind that Chinese McDonald’s incident it sounding like it would make for an intriguing movie.
btw I tried to choose my words carefully when using riding and Yorkshire but of course there can only be three ridings as it derives from the Viking word thriding (sounds like a very Yorkshire way of saying riding) which as you probably know means a ‘third’ – so no room for a South Riding without messing up the maths. Incidentally, the Norse word for a governing assembly is called a ‘thing’, which is probably quite appropriate given the current state of politics…
I thought folks might be interested in how odds on football matches are formed. The son of my neighbour supplies odds for bookmakers but is also a professional gambler and that’s his sole occupation. In essence he is really an actuary. Form obviously plays a part in setting odds, but one of the main sources is based on the number of fans who support a club. For example if Manchester United were playing away to Bournemouth the odds would still be reflected heavily on an away win based on the respective fan bases. Of course that doesn’t always prove correct. When Boro play Leeds the number of bets placed by Leeds supporters will always outweigh the number of bets placed by Boro fans. This can be neutralised somewhat by the confidence shown by the recent form of both teams and occasionally the bookmakers get caught out on individual matches, but rarely on a whole season. For every Leicester City there is always the credit of outweighing that with profits made on individual matches. Also as a gambler by backing outsiders say in horse racing, doubling up one’s stake money after each loss eventually he can make a profit when an outsider comes good. Of course you need large funds and nerves of steel to make a profit especially if gambling is one’s only source of income, but by supplying odds to bookmakers on football matches, that supplements his own winnings on gambling. It might sound a conflict of interest, but he does seem to be fairly comfortable financially. Fascinating though listening to him.
I dont think we are derailed so much as shunted on to the slow line as our stopper train is passed by all the other trains on the fast track.
A good piece yet again Werder, which will come first, a new manager or the new government?
Thanks Ian, I think Woodgate was probably the replacement bus service…
Another amusing article from Werdermouth. Perhaps if Zhang and his daughter are suddenly resurrected at Easter, maybe Boro might rise like a Phoenix from the Ashes at the same time. I wonder if my neighbour’s son has taken that into consideration. I’ve always maintained that past results can have no bearing on the present, and the fact that Hull City’s record away to Boro is only one win and one draw in the last 21 encounters might give some encouragement to some fans, but the fact is that if the toss of a coin has come down heads in 19 times out of 21, the odds of it coming down heads and a Boro win on the 22nd toss are still only evens. Similarly Barnsley had only beaten Boro once away from home in their first 16 encounters, but in the 1991/92 promotion season were one of only two teams to defeat Boro at Ayresome Park. Also Boro’s recent record at Elland Road has produced 3 wins, 3 draws and 4 defeats in their last 10 visits. So one might assume that Boro might gain 7 points from the next 3 matches on those statistics, but the likelihood is one point but 4 as a maximum and anything more than that would be a bonus.
Thanks Ken, I doubt many will be prepared to bet on Boro at the moment but what your stats indicate is that Boro could normally expect 7 points from the next three games so that should at least be the measure against what we do end up with.
Another great read Werder thank you.
I wonder if the next three games are the beginning of the end for JW and his backroom staff!
Given that both teams have a poor record at the Riverside then they are ideal scenarios for typical boro performances and with Bamford at Leeds then he is bound to score.
Sadly, I have reached the point where I am not looking forward to the games as I used to and have almost become resigned to what ever happens. 😎
Thanks KP, I think Sunday’s game will be critical as failure to win or even losing just increases the pressure for the Barnsley game on Wednesday. Woodgate could do without making the midweek game becoming one that everyone says he must win and it will mean the crowd will be both nervous and impatient.
On the flip side a win on Sunday will give the players confidence to beat Barnsley and who knows if Boro win two on the spin they may even get something from Leeds.
So on that basis the Hull game is pivotal and the result may well decide Woodgate’s fate if the players struggle against Barnsley. Though we’ll probably see two draws and that will just leave his position as it currently is – damaged but not quite terminal.
As ever, this blog is far to literal when it comes to facts. Don’t they know that the bald facts of Hulls form is, unfortunately, curtains for us, and, I fear for Woodgate.
Their form is blinding, and a team like Boro will be meat and drink to them.
So it’s another fearful trip for us fans.
Thanks Werder for another excellent read.
We have had the dreaded international break and still we have to wait another day to see what Boro can do against Hull. JW has had a long time with the players over the last two weeks, surely now we will see some passion/flair and goals. Or will it be same old same old. I rather think the latter.
Cheers Malcolm, a midday Sunday kick-off is probably not ideal to have the players fired up and it could be a lethargic display – hopefully results will go our way on Saturday but if not the pressure will be increased.
Just had a few minutes to read Werder’s excellent piece…..thanks Werder.
Been busy today and will be tomorrow, so thankfully or not, will catch the match on SKY.
I have been helpIng out for a Church Christmas Fete and have had lots of perspiration today and likely tomorrow..
As to the inspiration, I just do not see where that will come from, certainly not Woodgate. I just cannot see anything other that defeat a the hands of a decent Hull side. I will ask Santa tomorrow if there are any miracles going free.
Thanks Pedro, you may be better off asking Santa if you can hide in his grotto until Boro deliver a present of three points – btw I think it’s the other guy with the beard who is in charge of miracles 😉
Has Woodgate grown a beard then?
I think to many coaches are getting bogged down with a total football philosophy, what ever that is,
Liverpool in my opinion are no different to Burnley ,but they have better players to implement the system, their players are quicker in thought and feet, and know when to go long or short at the right times , but in essence use the same tactics, plus they are stronger in defense.
My advice to Woody maybe look in another direction , our midfield is weak so play two strikers and a wide man, and mix long with the idea of keeping possession too much.
When I saw the headlines that the Riverside was sold out, I said to myself “Strewth, Hull City usually only average about 15,000 for a home match; How can they sell so many tickets for an away match?”. Then I saw it was for a visit of the Killers. Who or what are they? I’ve never heard of them! Now if it had been for Neil Diamond or a comeback by Abba I maybe could have understood it, but so out of touch am I with what is now classed as music, I still harp back to the 60s.
Looking at a match preview I noticed this snippet amongst my morning reading:
“Middlesbrough are winless in their last nine Championship matches (D4 L5), last having a longer run without a win outside of the top-flight between January-March 1985 (10).”
Surely with two consecutive home games approaching that has to end but if perish the thought it doesn’t does anyone remembered how the Clubs fate fared shortly after that all those years ago?
The 1984-85 season started badly with just one point from the opening six games…
The run of ten games without a win started on New Year’s eve in 1984…
Then run finally ended in mid-March with…
But then continued…
Though Boro eventually escaped relegation by finishing one place above the drop zone after winning three and drawing one from their last six games!
I should add that shortly before that bad run started in 1984-85, a certain Steve Gibson joined the board in November. The club had rather ironically appointed a young locally-born former Boro central defender as manager that season in Willie Maddren.
For those without satellite tv who want to watch a live game, BBC2 are showing the Copa Libertadores live this evening.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/50503501
I think this international break will have been a good time for all at MFC to take a good look at the league table. I expect them ( even if it’s just professional pride) to be determined to get out of the bottom three.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see a new sense of purpose and drive on the pitch and hope that can be turned in to three points.
2-0
GHW
I do so hope you are right but this is the Boro we are talking about and a “typical boro” performance is always just around the corner.
I am afraid that I have not seen anything in this team or management that says yes we are on the right track and it is only a matter of time before it all starts coming good.
In fact, as I posted yesterday, I fear this could be the beginning of the end. I truly hope I am wrong. CoB prove me and other doubters wrong! 😎
My heart is with GHW’s sentiments but my head tells me that if we are now relying on a “Braveheart Boro” performance rather than clever tactical analysis and organisation then the games up. I’m sadly with KP in not seeing anything in the club, team or management that indicates we are on any track let alone the the right track.
Still its always darkest before the dawn as the saying goes. There again if Stoke win today at home to Wigan and Barnsley get something away to Blackburn then things could get a little bit darker still before tomorrow comes.
Equally, I wouldn’t be surprised not to see a sense of purpose on the pitch – the fact that we could equal our ten-game winless run of 1984-85 tomorrow despite carrying a wage bill of around £25m speaks volumes.
This squad of players should be doing a lot better than they have done this season and they need to perform. Woodgate also needs to prove he can make them perform and win games in the next seven days otherwise what do we think is Steve Gibson’s line that has to be crossed before he decides it’s not working?
Werder
That assumes there is a line and it’s not a case of “we are where we are” or “it is what it is”.
I personally cannot believe that SG will sit tight and allow the club he has invested so much time, effort, emotion and funds to be relegated.
I suspect that if we are still in the relegation area as we move toward the middle of next month without any indication that we can pull clear of the drop zone then he will act.
As well as a change in management he may well have to, despite the constraints of FFP, make funds available to a new incumbent. As we know FFP is calculated over three years so there is still time to make adjustments before we would be found to be in breach.
As much as we supporters do not want relegation there is one who wants it even less than the rest of us! 😎
I suspect if Woodgate fails to win either of the next two home games he’s toast and I wouldn’t be surprised to see Pulis arrive as either interim manager or in the Venables to Robson role.
Results today have generally been in our favour with the exception of Stoke.
Now can we deliver? 😎🤔
A win tomorrow would take us up to 20th – if that’s followed by a win against Barnsley it could possibly take Boro five points clear of relegation. Winning games sounds to me like the best plan to avoid relegation – though I’m sure it’s been thought of 🙂
KP, whilst I can agree with your sentiment re Mr Gibson and taking action if the next two games go belly up……the one issue that worries me, is egg all over his face.
Pride can be a big decider in decisions.
Winning is the idea but unfortunately we are not very good at that, 2nd bottom things are bleak
Nice one again Werder, the £ 2.61-pint beer of choice for me is the couple of pints of hobgoblin on the way to the Riverside on match days, but reckon the team should be wearing hobnail boots to ride roughshod over the other team.
UTB.
Well Stoke aside results today could have been worse, Luton nearly earned a point against Leeds and Barnsley managed two goals away to Blackburn but conceded three in return.
With regards to lines being crossed and SG sitting tight I couldn’t believe he didn’t back Karanka in that January, I was astonished when he sanctioned Gestede coming to the Club, forking out ludicrous sums for Fletcher and Saville etc. and sticking with Pulis when he lost the plot last season and with it costing us a Play Off spot by a solitary point. Mind you after the Villa Play Off disgrace the previous season I wouldn’t have continued with his services anyway.
My point is that there are decisions for a number of years now that I’m not sure are rational, indeed seemingly more eccentric or just plain strange. Throw in the Gazette journalists thing and then the ridiculous Woodgate appointment with the bizarre pantomime smokescreen and the out of touch thought that they could spin their way through it worries me a lot. That seemingly nobody dare challenge these things doesn’t fill me with confidence that the next decision will be any less disastrous than the others. Hope I’m spectacularly wrong.
I hope that you are wrong too although I have a fear that you may be right!
Like many others I would have dispensed with Pulis after the Vila play off games where it was clear that promotion was not on the agenda. As for last season, again some strange decisions on and off the field.
And now, as the festive season approaches, all we can hope for is for some seasonal cheer and some presents to open.
I will be setting off early for the game tomorrow so will post my prediction now – Roary hothead Lion 2 Tony the Tiger 1
As long as it is Boro that are Grrreeat! I don’t mind and 3 points is required.
Finally, thanks to Weder for the usual great article and I a,ways learn something new! Just wish Boro could as well.
UTB
Thanks BBD, hopefully we’ll all soon learn whether Boro can finally win a game…
As decisions go RR, when was the last decent one Mr Gibson made?
People may take exception to this perceived disloyalty, but the reality is there are there to see over more than a number of seasons now.
I will go for 2-1 win, too. But really, Hull are good on the road and it can easily be the usual.
But we have to believe and support the team. What else we can do?
I am not able to see the match live as I am attending a training vourse for my other hobby, photography.
Up the Boro!
The mention of the Tigers takes me back to an epic three game tussle in the FA Cup, drew at home and away then won the second replay 1-0 at York before a packed house.
A midday encounter on TV beckons and a desperate need for three points.
Ian
A trip down memory lane. I was at all three games. Let’s hope we don’t make it as hard work as we did then! CoB 😎
I was as well, I remember struggling to see the game at York as we got in to the ground quite late and struggled to actually see the pitch.
I also remember one game when we were due to play rugby for the school at Scarborough. There was a blizzard in the morning and got through Guisborough before the hill up to the North Yorks Moors only to be forced back.
Amazingly the match went ahead with mounds of snow around the pitch.
I see there is a colour clash, Hull’s old gold kit clashes with our red and white. Judith is meeting a fried for lunch so I will be on Taxi duties and miss about 15 minutes of the match around half time. I dont know whether to be upset at missing 15 minutes or having to see the 75!!.
I’ve just watched highlights on the Boro website of our game this weekend 9 years ago against Hull City played in a snowstorm and can’t recall the match at all. It reminded me of past matches at Ayresome Park, one against Rotherham in 1956 particularly comes to mind, and a FA Cup match against Birmingham City when I was in the boy’s end that was abandoned at halftime when the pitch became icebound. However I was surprised that this particular match in 2010 went ahead in view of the conditions. Still puzzled why I couldn’t recall this particular match I checked my old diaries and discovered that I was in Havana where English newspapers were non-existent and I missed contact with all football for a couple of weeks. In those days I didn’t have an iPad, but I do recall a few years later a match around Christmas against Hull, my first year with an iPad when I was in Northern Cyprus over the holiday period and Barry Robson scoring in the last minute to record a 1-0 win, and again when David Nugent did the same in Boro’s promotion season, a match that was televised. Any of those three results would be acceptable for me this afternoon, but preferably the latter two matches.
One other thing that I forgot to mention is an excellent interview by Joe Nicholson with Leo Percovich in the Hartlepool Mail. Leo
now is well settled in the village of Hurworth- on-Tees only 400 yards from Boro’s training ground at Rockliffe, and he considers that as home for he and his family. As an adoptive Teessider he appears to be even a bigger foreign Boro fan than Juninho.
Well just over an hour to go and I’ve been busy all morning on my living room project, which as usual has thrown up few surprises – none of which were pleasant 🙁
Anyway, the team should be released soon and I expect Woodgate will go with the QPR team – though I thought Dijksteel performed well and deserves the chance ahead of Howson, who has yet to show the kind of form displayed last season – then again who has!
I’m going for a 1-1 draw today with a goal for McNair.
Team news, it looks like Friend is injured again as not in the squad and I guess that’s a return to defence for McNair – Dijksteel does indeed start but so does Howson, which I guess is in midfield. As usual a very youthful looking bench with just young Clayton with any experience.
Starting XI: Randolph, Dijksteel, Fry, Ayala, McNair, Johnson, Howson, Wing, Tavernier, Fletcher, Assombalonga
Subs: Pears, Bola, Coulson, Wood, Clayton, Liddle, O’Neil
Yep, that’s my reading of it too.
Goodness me that bench looks a bare cupboard. I never thought I’d long for the days when we could bring on Diego Fabbrini or Amorebietta. Mind you, they’d both start nowadays.
Indeed, where’s Tarmo Kink when you need him! I wonder if playing Wood in defence would have been better than losing McNair from midfield. In reality there really only Coulson on the bench who could possibly change the game if we’re behind – though Liddle has had good reports but hasn’t had his chance yet. Plus will Tyrone O’Neil get an opportunity after being recalled from loan?
If anyone needs a link for today’s game…
Or this is a HD link…
Howson at CB, beggars belief. Why not Dijksteel.
May work at home if he doesn’t get too much defending to do as it will improve distribution from the back, have Dijksteel’s speed on the flank and McNair in midfield.
Still seems odd but Djicksteel is not the best defensively.
Fletcher just scored best goal of the season so far – would have made Leicester proud!
Totally agree about the goal in fact I would say it is the best team goal for many a season.
And then dear oh dear Johnson what were you thinking! 😎
I actually applauded the laptop for that goal – as for the red card, well there can be no complaints it was a terrible tackle. Boro looked really good going forward after that early goal, which thanks to Howson playing in central defence, McNair has been able to continue his driving midfield role. However, being down to ten men means if Hull were to score it’s going to get nervy.
Yes if it had been on MOtD
An excellent first half spoilt by a typical Boro moment which is going to make it a nervous second half.
Britt having his best game in a Boro shirt without scoring. CoB 😎
Yes, looking like a top notch player and why we paid big money for him. Not as Mach as 15mil though.
Well all going to plan, Howson not put under pressure and Boro playing, I have to admit, some lovely football and could of been out of sight with a little more luck.
Then what was Johnson doing there? There can be no argument with the red. Let’s Hull back in and a three match ban when he has been playing well. Typical Boro.
Bugger squared.
Well in the end two points thrown away and feels more like a defeat – not totally convinced that bringing on Clayton and sitting deep was the best way to defend a two-goal lead as it effectively said to Hull try and score – after all this is no longer the meanest defence in the league that it was last season. Though can’t really blame Woodgate as it was all down to Johnson’s rash challenge that cost us out first win in ten.
That leaves a bitter sweet taste, Great first half let down by a stupid challenge. Battling 25 minutes then two smacks to the crown jewels.
It could have been such a good win then looking like we would hold out and ending up being ‘grateful’ for the draw.
Things do look a bit brighter but teams at the bottom waste the chances they get to kick on and stay down there.
Yes Barnsley is even more important now to try and get some points before Leeds.
Got to agree with Werder. I know hindsight is easy, but to go utterly defensive was asking for problems and so it ensued.
It did not help that Clayton was booked for nothing, when the referee let fouls by Hull go unpunished and then he became almost Ineffectual in his role. However whilst it is also simple to point out perceived mistakes, I think Tav should possibly have been the one withdrawn. Twice for the goals, he was close to Bowen, but not close enough.
To be brutal, a team in the bottom 3, 2-0 up and cruising that still can’t win, is a team that gets relegated.
Still, the first 1/3 of the game showed that this team on paper is a good team. Maybe this display was just enough to spark an improvement.
That all said, it’s still no wins in 10.
Playing very well for 37 minutes masks a little Woodgate’s inexperience.
His second half tactics all wrong, Hull’s very good, but helped by Boro.
After a nervous start defensively you could see the confidence grow after Boro scored and they were certainly worth their 2 goal lead, if not more. Then that act of stupidity by Johnson not only cost us 2 points but will also mean a 3 match suspension for him. The first 35 minutes Boro actually looked a match for any team in the League and looked capable of scoring 2 or 3 more. But in the second half Hull showed Boro how to play against 10 men. It was almost like the days of 5 man forward lines, and but for the excellence of Randolph and some poor misses Hull would have won comfortably. Once Bowen scored his first goal I think the writing was on the wall.
However a more encouraging display, and one hopes that any confidence regained will not be eroded by one silly mistake. With eleven players on the field we looked a far better team than Hull, but once down to 10 men made City look like a top Premier League team. One good thing to take from the match is that Boro are out of the bottom three but only just!! Play like that with a full strength team, I feel confident Boro can finish mid-table as long as further suspensions and injuries don’t bite and we can keep our current squad of players. But that’s the rub.
That’s it Ken, Saville red and now a Johnson red. Unenforced stupid mistakes that makes a thin squad even thinner.
Instances like these happen to teams at the bottom and usually result in their demise!
They need to build on the first half performance and look for a strong display and win against Barnsley to build the momentum – failure is not an option and only likely to lead to a continuing fight against relegation which is still very much on the cards. 😎
The fans are not supposed to be clued up on tactics, but my gosh.
To be 2-0 up and send them out to cluster round the six yard box for 45 minutes, please!, give me strength.
Compounded by leaving Britt on. He is completely unsuited to jumping for high balls, and we will not speak of his ability at arm wrestling the CB for 45 minutes.
We did not need a goal, but we did need to keep the ball in their half for long periods
just to keep the pressure off our defence.
In effect we allowed them to wander at will into position for the most advantageous cross, and they took advantage of that wild idea.
They would, of course, have won. But when they equalised we had a hasty change of mind and got out of our box, and, in fact had the best break of the match and had the goal at our mercy, but for a heavy touch when entering their box, which put paid to that.
Very amateurish of JW to publicly blame Johnson. Thought the team were all in it together. Also JW half time change a disaster.
I listened to JW and have no issue with what he said, it is not calling a player out for performance, lack of effort or attitude. It is a clear red card for a poor challenge when we were cruising. It was not a team error. It was not a refereeing mistake, it was not a dive, it was not two yellow cards
The player knows he did wrong, he knows he has let the team down, I doubt he will have a quibble with the manager, he certainly wont be able to look Woodie in the eye and complain!
I thought about tactics when you are down to 10 men and what SrAlex used to do.
He would go to 342 but there are a couple of caveats. His front men were two out of Cole, Yorke, Sheringham and Solksjaer. Midfield out of Beckham, Keane, Butt, Scholes and Giggs. Make that a smattering of caveats
I suspect that made it a little easier for SrAlex than for JW.
Very good performance for 40 mins or so – Britt in particular was excellent in that period – and a truly brilliant second goal. It was looking like it could be something like a 4-0 thrashing until the red card. What on earth was Johnson thinking?
We were too negative in the second half and didn’t offer enough of a threat on the break to make Hull a little hesitant to throw extra bodies forward.
I must admit admit I had the same thought as Deleriad – games like that, when you trip yourself up more than anything else, really feel like those of a relegation side.
Still, if Friend can get himself fit for a run in the team and with Coulson now gifted a real chance to make the left wingback position his own, all is not yet lost. Oddly, despite immense disappointment today, I feel more confident for the Barnsley game.
Andy problem for me is Coulson is not good enough at defending. Saying that it appears Friend may be out for awhile, Johnson for three matches and Tav is it FB.
Andy R
I am very much afraid that Friend is in a difficult position re. his injury.
When getting an injury which lingers, it is most important to do two things.
1 find out the name and location of the best surgeon in the world for that particular sports injury.
2 contact him and fix an interview a.s.a.p.
Then book his services real quick because times awasting.
To the club you are of no value.
To the fans and the team your talent and enthusiasm are needed.
So get it fixed (for it will be fixable) you should be back in the team by February and we look forward to seeing you for you are needed.
Interesting article from our former blogmeister in the EG.
Whilst slating Johnson for his reckless tackle he makes the point that JW’s tactical switch cost us 2 points as he sacrificed AF’s mobility up front to sit deep and soak up the pressure which did not work.
The commentators on Sky made the point that JW is a young manager and still learning. I would suggest there were two major learning points for him from this game.
Firstly, when going down to 10 men do not leave BA on his own up front as effectively you are down to 9. If you are going to go one up front the do it with a player that is more mobile and more adept at running the channels and holding the ball up. AF is probably more adept in that role.
Secondly, when playing against 10 men take a leaf out of Hull’s book who gave a text book display today on how to do it, as opposed to our inept attempt against Fulham.
Exactly what my cousin said as we were walking back to the cars without the benefit of the experts!
As others have said, if we can see it, why can’t JW and the players.
Ian Gill….JW supported Assombalonga for many weeks when he was missing sitters and penalties and cost the team points. We all know that Johnson was wrong and he will be suffering tonight because of it. Woodgate has made it worse for him by saying he personally cost Boro the game.
I think it comes down to the individual. JW clearly thinks that Britt needs support – the opposite of how Pulis went about motivating him. Maybe JW has decided Johnson needs a kick up the backside.
Fine for me.
I disagree, Johnson has done something that was reckless. If he had not picked up a runner you can invoke the win and lose as a team mantra.
Many managers have criticised players in such a position, Johnson knows he did wrong and shouldn’t be fazed by Woodies comments.
Away from Boro’s problems for a moment, if I were the Manchester United chairman I would appoint Mauricio Pochettino as their manager before Arsenal or Everton get their hands on him. The three present incumbents at those major clubs are almost as out of their depth as Woodgate is at Boro.
Well just like those waiting for me to finish cooking dinner, Boro showed hunger and looked like having three points on a plate. However after an unsavoury challenge by Johnson, Boro made a meal of hanging on to their two-goal lead. Still it was a tasty first-half performance by Woodgate’s men but in the end did they get their just desserts? Anyway, here’s the man you’ve been waiting for to serve up the main course, it’s Redcar Red and his match report…
https://diasboro.club/2019/11/24/boro-2-2-hull/
Thanks RR. Spot on report and as always the truth.
An excellent appraisal from Redcar Red. What I will add is that Woodgate was wrong in stating that Marvin Johnson’s reckless challenge was the cause of Boro losing two points. It certainly made the game more difficult, but Woodgate was passing the buck here in my opinion. It was the coach himself who cost us the win with his ineptitude change of personnel and tactics at half time. Yes he was angry and disappointed at the final whistle but stating publicly that Johnson was to blame was not only naive but unprofessional akin to a Pulis comment. I noticed Dani Ayala put his arm around Johnson’s shoulder, as if to say never mind son. Sir Alex never castigated his players in public, but left such remarks inside the dressing room. On the display as a whole Boro outplayed Hull when it was eleven against eleven and should have been able to contain them in the second half with better tactics.Woodgate should ask himself who was more culpable Johnson or he himself.
Thanks Ken, totally spot, exactly as I was saying.
Ken, the sign of a man under pressure and making a dogs dinner of his tactics. He has a book of them and like Pulis, it was somebody else’s fault.
*spot on*
RR
Thanks for the match report
Johnson certainly didn’t shine this afternoon. Hull nearly cleaned up.
At least 1 point brightens things up
Appreciated as always
OFB
Thanks RR for your report. As usual you saw the same match as me though I couldn’t hope to report it anything like your standard! After the usual Boro starting jitters I thought (until the sending off) it was the best home performance of the season with two deserved and well created and taken goals. When I saw Clayton warming up my heart sank as I assumed we would spend the second trying to defend our lead. We (except apparently JW) know that Britt cannot play as a sole striker as he cannot win/hold the ball alone so the play just comes straight back at our defence. The first goal was preventable as we too often allow players to run at us without being tackled though it was a special shot. However the number of crosses we allow when we have proved to be vulnerable left me expecting the inevitable.
I won’t be at the Barnsley match as I decided that the hotels on that night were too expensive for the “entertainment” I have seen so far (though I have paid more in the past). I hope I will regret missing that elusive win.
Hull scored a worldly and one from a lucky bounce into their path.
Woodgate as every right to castagate Johnson , he let the team down , he could have backed off and then just stepped into the space when the Hull guy brought the ball to him, can’t they think , I’m not a fan of the new era of very little contact ,but that’s the way it is now I suppose.
The fact is right now , we need everyone on board, the team is very limited , although pumped up by the local rag, we are an old team ,slow with very little ambition, and worse no real class,
I don’t think we have the worse squad, but other teams seem fitter and move around the field more than we do, we play in straight lines and make it easy to to read what we are doing.
People moaning about Clayton coming on, that wasn’t the problem , the fact Woodgate hasn’t been picking him, tells you he is making decisions on these guys,
Tavarnier was the issue, I’m not blaming the kid, he was out of position but he struggled ,and their equaliser came when he couldn’t defend .
I did like the way we got the ball forward early
Though, which was encouraging.
Time will tell, but we all know we need at least five more players , but we won’t get them.
Just to finish, a little bit of luck might help, Woody went had much of it.
UTB.
Redcar Red,
So near but so far away. Thank you for the report and somehow that team needs to be motivated to repeat the first twenty odd minutes of play for he next match. I know that statement is just plain obvious but they can do it even with the limited resources available.
They say teams make their own luck at the top events go your at the bottom it is the opposite, particularly when the ‘stupid switch’ has been pressed. The fool gave himself no chance and the referee no choice. He needs to be taken to one side by Dickie Rooks and shown how to tackle. Mind you even Dickie wouldn’t get away with some of his tackles now.
Right, let’s see how we can cock-up the Barnsley match. Onwards and slightly upwards.
UTB,
John
Thanks RR for another spot on report which is much appreciated.
The pressure on JW is beginning to show as well as his inexperience. A tactical blunder followed by passing the buck onto a reckless Johnson whose red card was fully deserved.
All such a shame after such an encouraging start. It could only happen at the Boro!
I wonder what can go wrong on Wednesday! 😎
Lets be honest had we been offered a two goal cushion at half time but down to ten men we would have taken it before Kick Off.
The problem after the sending off was a self inflicted tactical mess. Bringing on Clayton to stiffen the rearguard and add some experience was one option but one which severely restricted and limited our ability to break out and ease pressure but fair enough, that was a predictable and calculated consequence. When it wasn’t working (and that was clear after ten minutes) it wasn’t changed. That the Coaching staff either couldn’t see it or tactically did not possess the collective intelligence to have done something about it is a worry.
We struggled when we tried four at the back when the season started, it never worked so we had to abandon that phase of the “transition” and go with 5 or 3+2 wing backs depending on how you want to describe it. Why on earth would you then switch to a back four at half time, bring on a defensive midfielder who hasn’t featured for most of the season and in doing so introduce a tactic that the team haven’t utilised successfully all season?
Why would you take your most effective midfielder McNair and then play him out of position especially when he was influencing the game so much up to that point? Why when you had two LB’s sat on the bench when Johnson was sent off you would take Tav who had also been effective and playing well, actually scored, and then square peg him into the LB slot?
Bear in mind that the defence had already been tinkered with before a ball was kicked with Howson playing as a makeshift CB so any more disruption was not the cleverest of thinking and should have been minimised. Britt was playing his best game for a very long time but he isn’t a hold up man, nor is he greased lightening and going to stretch the Hull defence. Fletcher has a burst of pace, something you need to keep your opponents occupied with. Likewise Coulson who would have provided another threat as well as replacing the departed Left Wing Back.
Simply keeping your defence structure intact by introducing a like for like and keeping your midfield who had bossed the game up to that point intact and then take probably Britt off would have made far more sense. Up until half time the Hull defence looked like a bag of nerves. Wing, McNair, Fletcher and Tav would have had enough to keep them twitching especially as they had to come out and attack. Sitting back absorbing wave after wave of attack after dismantling your midfield and disrupting your entire defence was once again naive. Doing nothing about your mistake was even worse.
There were so many things wrong with that second half that was down to poor in-game management that it simply confirmed what a lot of us knew back in the Summer. Wednesday night needs to be a defining moment, nothing less than a resounding convincing victory will keep fans on board. Even the Gazette have shown the first shoots of reality starting to hit home, not quite back pedalling just yet but the brakes look to have been tapped ever so lightly.
The shorter version of this is that it is the kind of mistake a rookie manager makes and kicks himself for. That all said, it was working passably well until a moment of brilliance. Hull didn’t get that many clear chances.
On paper, moving to 4-4-1 is a classic thing to do when you’re down to 10 men; it only takes one ball over the top when the other side is attacking and Britt can possibly knock in a 3rd. In reality, it just sent us back into our shell with all our failings exposed.
If you learn this as a manager in league 2 with your team in mid-table then it’s a painful lesson. In this case though it’s at risk of being a terminal one.
For what it’s worth, I think Woodgate is learning pretty quickly on the job. I’m not sure it’s quick enough but I reckon we still have about a 50/50 chance of avoiding relegation.
A back four hasn’t worked all season for us so putting it politely it was a bit of a gamble for Woodgate to think that fortune was suddenly going to change. Having to then change the positioning of four players to accommodate just one sending off when you are two goals up was crazy. A ball over the top can work but you need energy and pace to do that, attributes which so far not many of us would associate with Britt (thats intended as a dig at him). Had McNair and Tav been left in-situ and Fetcher stayed on in place of Britt that could have been a realistic threat and perhaps worked especially with Coulson being a like for like replacement for Johnson except faster, trickier and more direct.
Up until the sending off Hull’s defence was woeful and looked decidedly leaky, indeed as a side looked extremely poor. Losing a Striker but keeping the rest of the side intact would have restricted our attacking forays but not emasculated us. Eaves hadn’t been a threat, Bowen and Grosicki had done nothing at all until we sat back and invited them into the Bedroom.
Grant McCann of course also played a part by changing his side around with his Substitutions in the second half realising there was nothing to defend against. It wasn’t working for Boro and the inevitable was predictable yet our Coaching staff done nothing and just left things as they were.
I would love to see a copy of that infamous PowerPoint presentation to click on “File” and then “Info” to see who the real “Author” was. It may provide a clue as to who really suggested Dijksteel, Bola and Browne.
* Should say “thats NOT intended as a dig at him”
What does strike me is that both recent red cards were challenges in harmless positions with no danger. There was no need for Saville or Johnson to go lunging in off their feet in either case.
Now something lighter
For those who have Gold on their TV can look forward to ‘Dial M for Middlesbrough’ coming soon.
It is the third in a series of spoof whodunnits after ‘Murder and on the Blackpool Express’ and ‘Death on the Tyne’. I know the Gazette have had features on it.
It isn’t belly laugh stuff but it brings a smile to your face and a chuckle here and there.
The hero, Terry, is not Poirot and his girlfriend Miss Marple but are a good match.
Hmm the Gazette seem to be moving into neutral territory with their headlines!
Dom: “Woodgate has every reason to be jittery”
AV: “A defensive substitution swung the game Hull’s way & cost Middlesbrough two precious points”
Paving the way or just finally exasperated to the extent that like Bernie its now becoming a massive struggle just to stay onside?
Loved the criticism of young Tav. ” he was at fault for his defending”
As far as I was concerned the Coach was at fault for that disaster.
To do a monster shuffle because one idiot was sent off, when you are cruising it?
Come on, he’s a waster, no clue, never will have a clue.
It’s high time we stopped this sympathy thing with Woodgate. He’s a lucky boy to be given our train set to play with.
No professional manger would be allowed to get away with what he has over recent months.
It took a grim war of attrition to get Tav. And Wing in the team (and he’s only in as a defender) this in a team that cannot score to save their lives.
Both Tav. and Wing should have about thirty five straight matches under their belt as part of our attack by now, thanks to him they are still learning, in fact Tav. Did exactly what it says on the tin, caused problems and scored a beauty. Enter our hero, and enter about eight changes for one missing idiot. To put Tav. At full back was the outside of enough, to introduce a midfielder with a touch of the slows was bizarre,
To instruct them to stay in their six yard box was suicidal, and as for leaving Britt on the pitch? Quite what role he was going to play is still a mystery to everyone there.
Was it perhaps to out jump the lone defender? Don’t think so.
Was it maybe to out run him before smashing one into the top corner? Don’t think so.
Maybe he was going to take control of the ball and take it into the corner, wasting lots of time? Dream on.
A bad business, but the end must be in sight, surely.
It’s bad enough to criticise players in public but to single out one individual, is the sign of a manager with no idea of man management. Does he think Johnson deliberately went in to injure a player and risk an inevitable red card?
I’m pretty sure Johnson knows he made an error, but he doesn’t need his manager heaping every ounce of blame on him for not gaining three points.
Woodgate had ample time in the half time interval to organise his side and come up with a formation and the tactics to hold on for a win.
That he didn’t is as much down to him as it is to Johnson. I understand his frustration at not gaining a much needed win, but he showed his inexperience with those post match comments.
It was a pity as the first 30 minutes were amongst the best the squad have put out all season. I appreciate that JW is on a steep learning curve, but alienating players won’t help him. It would have been very helpful if he had a wily old bird with him in the dressing room. There’s plenty out there. (Holloway, Warnock etc)
I don’t understand why the chairman is just sitting by in complete silence.
I think the Chairman is either already putting an escape plan into action as was witnessed when Southgate beat Derby and Monk won at Wednesday. The decision had already been made, regardless of the results of those matches. Conversely maybe he has lost interest and is not bothered about taking us back down to League One and who knows even liquidation once again?
I was sat in a branded tax avoiding Coffee shop this afternoon (not by choice) and there were three “young” lads sat behind me (probably mid to late twenties) discussing yesterdays match, the sending off and the general state of the Club. It was interesting to hear their views on SG which is very much removed from the romantic notion that those of us who remember ’86 have. Being kind it sounded more like our views of the Charlie Amer era. Two of them thought Woodgate’s time was up but one of them was still very clearly and unshakably behind him and fully on board the whole Transition train thing believing that there was no way we would go down.
Watched a recording last night of Nigel Adkins post match views and I think I heard him say something like Woodgate will get the help he needs. I don’t know if that was just a throwaway comment or being in the game and knowing lots of other Managers and Coaches maybe he knows something we as yet don’t? I guess it would save some face if the DOF was finally recruited as part of “The Plan” after all. Short term it would probably save the day (and some face) but like Robbo found out when your time is up its well and truly over!
That’s the million dollar question GHW, and there will be no answer to it anytime soon.
Both Saville and Johnson made big mistakes making tackles in areas they did not need to.
Yes smack Johnson around the ears at half time in the dressing room, but to lay all the blame on him for losing a winning position, that is way out of order. I did not think much of his appointment, even less now.
Another fine mess you’ve got us it to Mr Gibson.
Lo siento RR, as they say here in Espana. A belated thank you for your warts and all report, especially the antics of our Head Coach.
Well tomorrow night is a must win game, no questions, no doubts, no draws.
Failure to win will have the 13,500 crowd booing vociferously at the end of the night. It’s the most important game of Woodgate’s managerial career and could mark the beginning of the end of it regardless of what the Chairman thinks or does short term. Play like we did in the opening 40 minutes on Sunday and it should be a foregone conclusion but finding continuity with both the squad and the tactics has been a problem this season for Woodgate.
Picking the team shouldn’t be difficult, whoever has more than ten starts at this level and is fit will be getting a game. The only exception to that is Clayton but there again don’t be surprised if he does bring Clayts back into the starting line up, shuffles his midfield all over the place and then shoehorns someone in at Left Back. If he does do that then it had better work and quickly because that scenario will have eyes rolling in the concourses before even a ball is kicked.
Its simple RR get your best eleven available players and play them in their natural positions. As well as his tactical ineptitude he has followed in the footsteps of his predecessors with too many square pegs in round holes albeit not always of his own making.
The beginning of the end started at half time on Saturday and anything other than a win will just progress it further.
Unless we start as we did on Sunday then I see it as another difficult evening and we may find Barnsley more difficult to break down than Hull. Goodness knows what the reaction will be if we fall behind!
Yet another evening where I have agreed to go out to dinner and will instead record the match. Sad state of affairs when I feel that way, as in seasons past I would never have missed a match when I had the opportunity to watch it live.
CoB give us some hope! 😎
KP
Well I am on the road to recovery but still not well enough To go to games
Mrs OFB went with one of my granddaughters on Sunday I watched on TV until Hull scored. Then switched off
Not going tomorrow don’t know if there’s a stream but not really bothered
It’s a sorry state of affairs and I’m really fed up like most of us
OFB
Made me chuckle……
An old Yorkshireman is lying in his bed dying. With a very weak voice he asks:
Is my wife here?
Yes, I am here.
Are my children here?
Yes, your children are all here.
Are my grandchildren here?
Yes grandad, we are all here.
– Then why is the light in the kitchen still on?
Middlebrough hoping to land Kieron Freeman from Sheffield United in January – but not the only Championship club keen on the Welsh international.
OFB
Freeman not had great or even good reviews.
Come on BORO.
I like it. Probably from North Yorkshire. Middlesbrough possibly?
OFB, the match will be on the red button if you have sky or find a pub with sky 😉
Come on BORO.
Thanks Exmil
You can also watch via the Sky app if you have a smartphone.
Exmil, unfortuanately I have SKY but through the internet, so no SKY remote and red button.
I will have to trawl the outer reaches of the dark web to find a stream, hopefully Werder will find one before me. 🙂
OR HAVE A GREAT TIME AND DON’T WATCH
OFB
All we need is for Vincent Price to stand in for MMP and the stage would be set for a mid week horror story complete with fog and mist swirling in from the Tees.
Well George is apparently out until February although which February wasn’t confirmed. We know that Saville and Johnson are also out through suspension and Gestede and Browne are also crocked along with Randolph who is still struggling. That’s six out of Woodgate’s first team squad missing or doubtful for tomorrow night, on paper not good but then three of them wouldn’t make most peoples first eleven and Friend hasn’t been himself since the Premiership when he was originally crocked. Therein lies one of the Clubs major problems in that they all expect to be paid.
Oops I forgot about Shotton! That’s seven not six missing or doubtful.
What´s wrong with Shotton? I thought he was going to be and the Int. break?
I checked the MFC website and the match on Wednesday is available via Riverside live worldwide. Both in audio and video mode.
Looking forward to seeing Boro again. The first half versus Hull was better than any match I can recall from the Pulis era.
We are staying up. Up the Boro!
Thanks Jarrko, or maybe not????
It is perhaps worth remembering that Barnsley will also see this match as a must win game.
To the Victor go the spoils!
Or it could be a point each following a riveting 0-0! 😎😂
OFB
It is good to learn that you are on the road to recovery and very sensible that you don’t attend the Riverside tomorrow as we wouldn’t want you to risk putting your recovery in jeopardy!
We hope that JCUH managed to identify and come up with a solution to your problems and that you will soon be fully recovered and re-joining Mrs OFB at the Riverside if you are able to stomach it! 😎
OFB
Supporting Boro is part of our DNA but health is more important, make sure you are well enough before attending the Riverside. Some warmer weather would be beneficial then you could have a snooze under a blanket with some fresh air to boot without any excitement.
Well only the Luton result went against us in reality. Pressure now on tomorrow night and no amount of excuses from Woodgate will suffice.
It’s three points and nothing else.
Maybe we should get Andrew Neil to interview the powers that be at MFC. Failure to win tonight would be a real blow.
Failure to win tonight would see superstores on Teesside wiped out of Pledge, Windowlene, Brasso, Silvo, Mr Sheen and Beeswax stocks along with a host of other similar products as the spin machine would need to go into overdrive feverishly polishing whats left of the unflushable thing floating in the bottom of the pan.
Is it floating or sinking due to lack of fibre?
If ever a manager’s job was on the line with regard to just one game, then tonight’s fixture is exactly that. Anything other than a win, will and should result in JW being removed from his position.
No, ifs buts or maybes!
Like Bob I’m not too well either at the moment. On a course of antibiotics to get rid of a kidney infection which doesn’t help me to sleep for more than an hour or so at a time. Tired but not depressed enough though to not watch the match tonight. I just hope my latest setback doesn’t derail my eight week trip to the Algarve in January. I’ve already lost two holidays at the eleventh hour due to health problems, not to mention the cost. I should know better at my time of life, booking holidays when feeling well, but having to cancel later. The trouble is I’m too optimistic instead of being realistic and that’s the same with Boro as well, but when feeling well failing to accept my limitations. Perhaps I should accept the limitations of our football team also. Anyway Bob hope you’re soon feeling better, the best tonic being a win tonight.
Ken
Sorry to hear you are presently not feeling too good. Hope you soon feel better and that it does not impact upon your planned trip. A Boro win tonight should be a good tonic so fingers crossed for the team, yourself and OFB.
Just been across to the golf course to meet the Director of golf to resume our membership from next year. The club has been very considerate during Karon’s battle with Albert and agreed to re-instate our membership for the full twelve months at no cost to us which, in a highly commercial business, was pleasing.
We managed half an hour on the putting green without any ill effects for Mrs P. It will be interesting to see how she copes when she starts swinging a golf club in the next few days/weeks.
Little steps towards getting back to full fitness albeit scans have revealed gallstones in her gallbladder and a hernia, so we are now deliberating if she should undergo further surgery next year!
I suppose you know better than many of us that as we get older it is often a case of learning to live with and manage our problems.
Best wishes on getting rid of your kidney infection soon. 😎
Positive attitude and live every day is what I say
Ken thanks for your thoughts
OFB
I guess it’s moment of truth time tonight and a game Boro and especially Woodgate must win. Not many options left in terms of team selection and I’d imagine Coulson coming in as a straight swap for the less than marvellous Marvin.
An early goal again would definitely help as would no red cards but I fear the extra pressure on getting the win may lead to a few fluffed lines and dare I say the risk of a costly error.
Despite their lowly position, Barnsley shouldn’t be underestimated as they’ve actually scored two goals in 5 of their last 8 games. They may even try to get the impatient Riverside crowd worked up and tetchy and may go for broke.
Prediction: 2 – 2 again with a late equaliser from Paddy saving the day – or not as a draw will please nobody.
No option other than five at the back and how JW makes that up.
We can only hope that Randolf is OK as he will give that extra confidence to those in front of him. (no disrespect to Pears)
No sure about Coulson though he should add to an attacking force. Problem is going to be having Fletcher as his defender and if that is the line up then I am sure Barnsley will attack that side.
Howson did well in the three but was not really put under pressure. I am sure it could be different tonight.
As Werder pointed out, Barnsley score goals and we leak them. However no excuses, a win is needed. If we do not get three points, JW should do the honorable thing and fall on the sword. But I doubt it. And no action from Mr Gibson either.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see us draw or even lose tonight then go and beat Leeds 3-1 on Saturday in a “Typical Boro” week! Question is if we don’t win tonight where does that leave the one formerly known as Village in the same city on Saturday?
If things go badly I suspect that Woodgate would walk (or at least be given the option/invitation) rather than both he and SG having to face the ignominy of him being fired. The positive is that the eternal question of who SG should bring in doesn’t really apply as anyone could better an 11% win rate, even Trashcans was 28%. As it is Barnsley who were the architects of Mogga’s last stand for those interested his Boro win rate was 40%.
To be fair to Woodgate he shouldn’t have any responsibility to walk as his lack of experience isn’t something that has suddenly happened and he’s only just got a First XI to pick from. You could also say that the first 35 minutes on Sunday did demonstrate that he and Keane have proved they can coach the players to perform better.
The real problem is he’s still learning how to be a head coach and work out how to deal with things that arrive tactically during a game. That for me was more of a reason not to pick him in the first instance to be in charge and not a new reason to dismiss him. However, in the end he needs results like any manager and this run can’t be allowed to persist indefinitely without some kind of action being taken.
We simply need to win games and if Woodgate can’t achieve that then Gibson will need to find someone who can before it becomes too late to matter.
All the ducks finally get into line tonight, and, of course, when that happens, actions are taken.
We all know what those actions are, the Chairman speaks, and the words he speaks are not good, certainly not good for our coach.
It should not have come to this, for our problems have been apparent since the (failed attempt by the players to dump AK) I can only think they must have missed him with the chair.
The strange and terrible thing about that whole episode is the fact that it was known, by everybody, far and wide.
In the real world, their subsequent awful defeat by the disorganised rabble that was Charlton (was it their only victory that season?) would have led to the greatest annihilation since the Teutonburg forest (where are my legions?).
Instead they had the brass neck to stay and enjoy the promotion by AK.
No wonder they didn’t try very hard in the Prem.
Best wishes to Ken, OFB and Karon. Three points tonight please to make us all feel better.
Indeed, all the best to Ken, OFB and Karon, some things are more important than football.
I see the Circus in the form of Rooney has just rolled into your town Ian so should provide some entertainment or just light relief one way or another.
Thanks for all the best wishes and kind words
Obviously not going tonight hope we win !
2 0
UTB
OFB
Team news: The main change see Pears in for Randolph who seems to be injured again and Coulson coming in for the suspended Johnson. A surprise name on the bench in Hackney, unless that’s just the Taxi for Woodgate should Boro lose tonight…
Starting XI: Pears, Dijksteel, Howson, Ayala, Fry, Coulson, Wing, McNair, Tavernier, Fletcher, Assombalonga.
Subs: Mejias, Bola, Wood, Clayton, Liddle, Hackney, O’Neil.
Yes becoming a little too often now with Randolf.
Like Friend, maybe he came back too soon when they were both surprise starters at QPR.
Yes, best wishes to Bob, Ken and Karon. Far more important than anything at the Riverside tonight.
On that front however, no Randolph. Gulp. In fairness Pears did perfectly fine in his previous appearances.
Boro 3-1 Barnsley
I’m sure Barnsley will buoyed by seeing the inexperienced keeper plus stand-in central defender Howson flanked by the further inexperience of youngsters Dijksteel and Coulson as wing-backs. I suspect they’ll be under orders to test the Boro defence early doors as they say.
Anyway, hopefully the Riverside isn’t too silent this evening – but after noticing that Barnsley have a certain C Chaplin playing in attack, let’s hope Boro don’t defend like the Keystone Cops…
Hopefully they’ll Buster a gut to keep them out…..
The4 conditions look distinctly damp, if it keeps up and the ball stops running the ref may have a decision to make. Hopefully drainage is so good all should be fine.
A couple of free kicks where the sailed over the bar, in these conditions make the keeper work even if it is relatively straight forward.
The conditions tonight seem to be a metaphor for the season as Boro appear to be treading water. The loss of another player to injury in Dijksteel has meant suspect left-back Bola is now our right-back – worse may follow as Britt was limping heavily as he left the pitch. Barnsley seem to be coping better with conditions and have been flowing forward at will. I suspect the weather will be the excuse for Woodgate tonight if Boro are sunk by Barnsley.
Boro started well, for the first ten minutes or so and then….flat. Barnsley playing with the conditions, Boro playing against them. If they score I think that could be it.
I have liked the look of Dijksteel, so to see him go off so early that is hard. I am starting to believe JW must be jinxed, we are now weak in both FB positions tonight.
Coulson maybe OK when he goes forward, but he is so slow getting back and Tav and ultimately Fry having to cover.
The way we are playing,I just cannot see us scoring at the moment. Can JW use all his experience to change how we are playing? Worryingly, Britt was limping off a little at HT.
Happy to se us score- as long as we don’t throw it away again……
Thankfully Boro have scored and it was a bit reminiscent of the Matrix as Keanau Fletcher appeared to be moving in slow motion as Barnsley defenders came quickly sliding in and missing the ball.
A goal up but showing no energy, whereas Barnsley at least are trying. Boro as lethargic as I feel at the moment.
It is poor, some definitions
a. Having insufficient wealth to meet the necessities or comforts of life or to live in a manner considered acceptable in a society.
b. Relating to or characterized by poverty: the poor side of town.
2. Deficient or lacking in a specified resource or quality: an area poor in timber and coal; a diet poor in calcium.
3. Not adequate in quality or quantity; inferior: a poor performance; poor wages.
4. Negative, unfavorable, or disapproving: has a poor opinion of the mayor.
5. Undernourished; lean. Used especially of animals.
6. Humble; meek: “Let the humble ones arise, the poor in heart be glad” (John Greenleaf Whittier).
7. Eliciting or deserving pity; pitiable: couldn’t rescue the poor fellow.
n. (used with a pl. verb)
Or MFC
Ian,
Or it’s cack?
UTB,
John
Not a great game for the conditions. We were quite comfortable after the goal. Should have scored a couple more.
Ayala and Fry were good tonight. Also Tavanier and Assombalonga shined. MOM was propably the Barnsley keeper. Ours was beaten once but the cross bar was there to clear.
When have we lost the last time? Up the Boro!
I thought Tavernier is looking better with each game and has good pace – as had Coulson who nearly broke through the middle to score plus beat his man quite a few times out wide. We can only hope neither Fry or Ayala get injured any time soon as we will be looking very thin at the back. btw don’t fancy Bola as right-back for Leeds and would probably prefer Clayton if we’re scratching around for someone to play there.
As unconvincing a victory as you could possibly see and Boro with just 37% possession at home against the bottom club – nevertheless the key word in that sentence was victory and it brings that ten-game winless run to an end.
The three points take us up to 20th place but still only one point above relegation – will this see us start to climb the table? possibly not but it at least stops the rot.
Though victory came at a price in terrible conditions with Dijksteel and McNair leaving the pitch with injuries that will make the selection for Leeds more difficult. Though what we did at least discover was that it’s going to be a long difficult season and points will probably not come easily.
Did we ever think it was going to be an easy season? I knew it would be a long hard grind but not this hard or as poor as we have been.
The injuries and suspensions have made it extra hard and the subs bench just shows the lack of strength in depth that we have.As long as we don’t decide to cancel games, then I still feel that we can stay up.
We needed that win tonight and let’s hope that we can slowly move up the table. Who knows we might even get a point at Leeds- I can but dream I suppose but this is Boro!
A point at Leeds would be great but I suspect the fallout from this game will see a rather depleted leggy looking team walk out at Elland Road.
I think McNair has looked off the pace the last couple of games. I wonder if he has been carrying a niggle?
Tav, MOtM for me. Best game since he came back for Fry. All teams get injuries, we have been unlucky and not helped by the self inflicted red cards.
Though Mr Gibson has to take the biggest blame for not adding to the already smallish squad. He knew what was going to happen and has not managed it well at all.
Werder
‘Though what we did at least discover was that it’s going to be a long difficult season and points will probably not come easily.’
It did not need your fine word craft to make those points, does the German healthcare system pay for tongue in cheek syndrome?
I should have added given how hard work it was to beat the bottom club at home – I was looking at the table and there’s no real escape from the bottom three unless Boro keep on winning – the question is where are the points coming from with a squad that gets thinner every time we play. Boro may have escaped a relegation spot tonight but could easily be back there by Sunday. There was no sense from tonight’s display that Boro will now kick on.
Nice to see the Gazette give Ayala man of the match. Lets get his new contract sorted as soon as possible.
Considering the position he was playing in, I thought Howson was excellent. But the MOM was the Barnsley GK.
One big positive tonight other than the three points of course, was that every player tried their best. At least JW still has the players on his side. Yes, it was only Barnsley but they were pretty good going forward and it’s obvious that their defence is the reason why they are in the position they are.
That’s a run of not losing developing hopefully they can keep that up.
While the phrase that it never rains but it pours has been the sentiment for many supporters turning up at the Riverside this season, Boro were hoping not to miss the boat this time as they attempted to end their long dry spell without victory. Although, in the end Woodgate’s team made heavy weather of seeing off bottom-club Barnsley but the crowd could at last soak up the emotion of finally achieving three points. One man who never waters down his thoughts on Boro’s performances was there to witness the deluge of points that ended the drought – so here are the dry but unspun observations of Redcar Red with his match report…
https://diasboro.club/2019/11/28/boro-1-0-barnsley/
RR
Thank you for braving the atrocious weather and giving us a match report which portrayed the game last night so accurately.
Pleased that Fletcher seems to be getting more confidence and amongst the goals.
Also from your match report and listening to the radio it appears that Tav is settling down into a first team slot after a run of games
Appreciated as always and if we have 11 fit players for Saturday we still will get torn apart gulp !
OFB
At least some good news for Saturday, ….we have Saville back!!!
We had to do the bare minimum and win, and that’s what we did. In our relegation under Agnew we managed to beat rock-bottom Sunderland but that meant nothing. Hopefully that isn’t the case this time.
The positives: the players don’t seem to have lost confidence in Woodgate. Woody also seems to have made a good call in putting Tav into a midfield three. Howson has done well at the back but hasn’t really been tested. Britt, Fletcher and Tav seem to enjoy playing together and have a good understanding.
Looking at the last 10 years, in 8 of them an average of 1 point a game is enough to avoid relegation. In theory as long as we do no worse than we have done so far, we have about a 80% chance of staying up.
Bruce
Good positive post !
OFB
Hull spanked Preston last night so that gives a bit more credit to the Sunday first half performance.
Looking on the bright side we have only lost one in six but the problem is the squad is getting thinner by the match. Saturday at Leeds may be damage limitation.
Fletcher, Britt and Tav looked bright.
It is Thanksgiving Day in USA, seems opportune that we are out of the bottom three.
Having missed the first 25 minutes as I’d fallen asleep I’m most appreciative for Redcar Red’s excellent 200 plus line review of the match. The match may have been low on quality but I doubt RR missed reporting any tackle or goalmouth incident and for that reason I’d make him my man of the match. Those that attended the match should also get a message in dispatches, but on the field of the play that I witnessed I’d give it jointly to Marcus Tavernier and Dani Ayala.
Just to add to my earlier post, Redcar Red’s report of the match was so comprehensive that it overwhelmed Philip Tallentire’s by well over 2 to 1 in narrative and quality. Just think about that! An amateur reporter ‘outplaying’ a professional journalist. I doubt you’d find that anywhere else in the country where a local fan could write a report so articulately on a club’s football forum as RR did last night especially of a match of such low quality albeit played in difficult conditions. Come to think of it, where else would you mind a forum anywhere as good as Diasboro?
As always a thank you to RR for his report. A win is a win which is good although yet another injury is not good. I am still waiting for the report that contains the phrase” Boro played the opposition off the lark for the whole game” and I suspect that those words will not be used this season!
RR and the other dedicated souls (all 18000 of them) deserve a medal for turning out – us distant supporters have an excuse for being sensible in not going!
Hopefully the win will be a turning point and Providing that we can put out a half fit team on Saturday and not avoid a thumping, then I do feel more positive.
Only another 25 points required for safety!
UTB
Just a thought, but it could be that we had our biggest lucky break for some considerable time last night.
Had it not been on Sky the ref might well have pulled the plug on the game after ten minutes.
When one considers the amount of falling down, sliding, tripping, and general mayhem, together of course with the wind and rain, he would not have been criticised.
Glad we won, it was needed.
Our problems have not gone away, far from it.
Our goal and its architect Tav. Raised yet more questions about our coach.
He has spent two seasons in denial about both him and Wing, and in my opinion is still in denial.
Had it not been for Tav’s ruthless treatment of his opponent and subsequent use of the ball he won there was no three points.
Because the conditions were dreadful, some idea of the best way to minimise the effect of said conditions would have helped. We could have practiced on the pitch during the day, because that’s the sort of thing that coaches do, it’s called cheating. We, very obviously did no such thing. And why am I not surprised.
Instead we spent the first half trying short slow passes, Barnsley in contrast, utilised very brisk twenty yard passes, plus plenty of over the top passes into our half, generally out wide.
We also consistently tried to dribble out of our own box, and had several near death experiences.
The jury is still out.
Plato
“He has spent two seasons in denial about both him and Wing, and in my opinion is still in denial”.
JW was only appointed at the beginning of this season so how can you say he has been in denial for two seasons?
They have both played, injuries excepted, a fair proportion of games this season and whilst Tav has been more influential in the last two games neither him nor Wing are exactly setting the world or the team alight in my opinion. 😎
KP
It may have escaped your attention that this person was fully involved for the whole of last season.
Nothing that happened during the car crash that was last season has changed this season.
There is every reason to suspect that Pulis (as he intimated)was, unknown to us poor benighted fools, acting as someone rebuilding the club in the organisational sense. Whilst Woodgate was busy on the training ground
To be specific, anyone with eyes to see, was aware that it defied belief to leave both Wing and Tav out as we imploded last season. And please do not say that Tav. Was young.
That is a red rag to a bull to the supporters, any observers of the well run teams, knows that they are right now, concentrating on their young to very good effect.
As to Wing, he is a goal scorer, to play him in midfield (with special attention to defence) is counterproductive, he is desperately needed in and around the box.
The business of bringing on Tav. for the last three minutes when we were loosing, repeatedly, was foolish and has never been explained to us fans.
We will never know why we keep getting reports of Gestede, for he will never be fit, and will never be a member of this team.
And there’s the rub. If we know it why is it not apparent to the club, or at least it’s representative on earth.
To sum up, the same players are being selected, or ignored this season as last season.
The accession of Wing and Tav. to the team is belated and welcome, but I think is grudging, the use of subs is abysmal, tactics are non-existent as noted by the opposition, and the news that Woodgate will have the last word on transfers is chilling.
PS
I agree entirely with your comment that “our problems have not gone away, far from it”.
More likely a stay of execution.
I thought the Sky commentator hit the nail on the head when summarising the game, “not pretty but gritty” which was what was needed on the night. 😎
Thanks RR for your excellent report.
Did you have your wellies on in all that rain.
Not many people will agree but I thought Boro were lucky to get 3 points. Overall I think Barnsley deserved a draw.
Thanks RR for another excellent report and not a drop of rain on the page!
I decide to watch the game after my evening out whilst enjoying a couple of whisky and ginger night caps. Both were more enjoyable than the fair on offer at the Riverside.
I thought Barnsley moved the ball about well and had more idea and intent than we displayed at times but fortunately for us it came to nothing.
I also thought at times it had all the hallmarks of a division 1 game and many of our regular failings were on display; a lack of structure to our play, repeated wasting of all types of deadball situations and consistently misplaced passes. I accept that the conditions had a major impact but it was the same for both sides and to my mind Barnsley handled it better.
I know you and others have doubts about Fletcher, but I believe he has the makings of a good striker at this level and offers a lot more than BA. He has skill on the ball, pace and has shown in the last two games an ability to remain composed and to be able to execute. He needs to be played centrally and with another striker alongside him to get the best out of him.
I can’t see Saturday being an enjoyable or comfortable watch but there again nor is it likely that the rest of the season will be given on what has gone previously. I still fear very much that Division 1 continues to beckon. 😎
Fletcher has definitely got his mojo back, amazing what a few goals can do!
Many thanks RR for your excellent match report. I think I would have been tempted to have stayed at home, saved on the overpriced walk up ticket cost and stayed dry with a nice glass of something alcoholic.
I did ask if anybody knows when Shotton is due back or is he long term? If we lose either of Ayala or Fry, Woodgate may have to give Hutton another call.
There is a good chance the players may be a little leggy on Saturday after last night. It will be more than interesting to see what team can be cobbled together. And please JW no gambling with any only half fit players.
RR,
Thank you for a report of the usual and expected high standard, I don’t envy your job on Saturday though. However Boro being typical Boro could surprise us. I think most of us will probably not be surprised.
Meanwhile the steady rain continues, is anybody predicting a waterlogged pitch?
UTB,
John
John in answer to your concern about the Leeds pitch being waterlogged, the next forecast rain is a week today and Saturday is due to be sunny intervals with moderate wind about 3 or 4 degrees. While people point out it was only Barnsley, we managed a victory, which Bristol City, WBA, Swansea and Derby couldn’t manage so far this season.
To me, it was worth getting soaked going and coming back from the east upper last night, to get the 3 points. The match was played in atrocious conditions and it is credit to MFC and their ground staff that the game was completed. No, it was not a classic but it was two teams that as well as battling each other, they were also fighting the elements.
After 10 league matches without a win, I am happy to take any type of victory against anyone in this league. I still believe we can avoid relegation although it might be tight but if we were sitting comfortable in mid table, there would be no need for a Exmil Challenge this season.
Come on BORO.
Exmil,
I’m with you on that one. A goal is a goal however it got into the net.
The sun is shining here in Norfolk but very little wind. Please do a typical Boro tomorrow.
UTB,
John
Arsenal have sacked their manager, wonder if they might move for Pochettino?
A quick look at the table shows……
Sheff Utd
P 13 W 4 D 6 L 3 Points 18
Arsenal
P 13 W 4 D 6 L 3 Points 18
Sheffield have had a fantastic start to the season and Arsenal sack their manager. It all comes down to fans expectations.
GHW
Your point about the identical records of Arsenal and Sheff. Utd. Is illuminating.
But consider the following point.
The big clubs are big because they are successful.
They are successful because they stamp their feet and scream and scream if things do not go their way.
The press help by telling the world and their players that they must be successful, or else!
Most important, they sack their manager, real quick, if mid table threatens.
All points we could copy, together of course by not employing locals of doubtful talent.
Can’t remember what happened when we last employed a foreigner, we probably appeared in serious and important games, bought decent players who could be sold for cash money, sold players we had raised our self for cash money, appeared in the Prem.
Oops sorry, that’s going too far.
If Paddy and Britt are carrying knocks/injuries I would rest them tomorrow and keep them for Charlton and play the following team:
Pears
Howson Wood Ayala Fry Coulson
Tavernier Wing Saville Bola
Fletcher
Come on BORO.
That’s actually a very good plan and is the sort of set up needed to try and keep Leeds at bay. I may be inclined to put Clayton in rather than Bola to beef up the defensive aspect.
Hoping for a draw tomorrow which will be a good result
UTB
Hear hear Exmil.
Anyone who has the slightest niggle should be rested against Leeds and the youngsters given a go. This is a game that we would be odds on to lose even with our best possible team and so it’s a genuine free pass for the club to give people a rest and look forward to the games to follow. The management team can see how some of the youngsters perform in genuine game situations and learn more in ninety minutes than half a season of playing U23 and sitting on the bench.
UTB
Selwynoz
Smiled at your point about learning more in ninety minutes then a month of practice matches and the bench.
He spent last season not playing the best prospects we have at the club.
I doubt he ever looks at anybody.
Perhaps its a luxury you can afford when you know it all.
I wasn’t aware that JW was the manager last season.
Wing played 34 times last season. If someone couldn’t see him, they may be rather closer to home than Woodgate. More opinion masquerading as “fact “.
As someone who struggles to be in the festive spirit a day either side of the actual event, I’m still recovering mentally from having to go to my son’s class Christmas party yesterday – I’m still getting flashbacks of seeing children wearing Santa hats dancing round a Christmas tree.
Anyway, moving quickly along… I suspect Boro may be the ones handing out gifts this afternoon at Elland Road given their mounting injury list. Woodgate seems to be inferring some will need to play through the pain barrier – though it’s probably only fair given most of us have had to watch through the pain barrier for most of the season.
With Dijksteel now out for a month then it’s time to find a new right-back – Since McNair sounds very doubtful (and it would be unwise to aggravate his injury) I wonder if Wing could fill in now that Saville can return from suspension into the midfield. As for Britt? well we’re told he hasn’t been able to train but if it was just a knock then he may be able to play.
I wasn’t convinced by Bola defensively as a left wing-back, let alone a right wing-back – though he could be deployed further up-field. So I’d go for a slight tweak on 5-3-2 with Clayton and Saville playing in front of the defence with Tav playing in the space between them and the front two.
Pears
Wing – Howson – Ayala – Fry – Coulson
Clayton – Saville
Tavernier
Fletcher – Assombalonga
Prediction: Leeds don’t concede many but they also don’t score many either so a well organised (I know what some are thinking) team could come away with a creditable 0-0. Although I guess few would fancy anything from this game.
btw I’m off to watch my son play in his first Handball match today (third generation after his mother and grandfather) so will hopefully just make it back in time for kick-off.
We are on a hiding to nothing with this game and as Selwynoz said, it’s a free pass.
I do not think any of the FB’s or WB’s if you want to call them, are good enough defensively. Leeds will use that to good effect I am afraid, especially Boro reject Harrison.
Even I have sympathy for JW with this afternoons selection.
After reading the Gazette and the lack of players available to replace those injured, why doesn’t Mr Gibson save some more money by knocking the Academy on the head.
All we hear is, well Wood is only young, so and so has not played a first team game yet. It’s now **** or bust time. Either they are ready to step in or what is the point. Other teams have youngsters playing and doing OK. I am not saying they will be as good as the player they replace, but that is why you have reserves and not excuses.
I agree with ExMil and several other comments on this forum that Assombalonga and McNair should both be rested for today’s match although I doubt Woodgate will be of the same opinion. I would play Wing and Tavernier just behind Fletcher with Clayton and Saville in midfield. It’s time to bring Wood into the team and with Howson, Ayala, Friend and Coulson part of a 5221 system. To revert back to a back 4 would be disastrous as would conceding an early goal. If Boro can keep a clean sheet there’s always a chance however remote that Boro might sneak an unlikely winner. I would much prefer that Boro don’t score too early but frustrate the home fans and score a late winner on the counter attack. I’m not saying it will happen, but if I was a gambling man a £50 bet at odds of 17-2 would be a tidy profit of £425.
I take it you mean Fry instead of Friend
Come on BORO.
ExMill
Sorry! You’re right.
So McNair and Britt play but Coulson is injured and it appears either McNair is part of a back three or it will be a back four with Bola at left-back. Saville returns after suspension.
Starting XI: Pears, Howson, Ayala, Fry, Bola, McNair, Wing, Saville, Tavernier, Fletcher, Assombalonga
Any streams Werder please
There aren’t usually any on Saturdays unless it’s televised – just the Riverside live for overseas viewers. btw Bamford just scored and there was no lack of celebration!
Werder
It could have started better, it looks like a long afternoon ahead of us.
Managed to get the game on vipbox
Here’s that link for anyone else..
Listening to Radio Leeds they sound like world beaters when they clearly aren’t.
It’s 2-0 at half time and the comments of the Leeds commenters on Boro include – dreadfully poor, inept, the space between the lines is all wrong, they are not working hard enough, not closing down , they are all over the place. As they leave the field their heads are down..
Leeds could be in for a big win.
Anyone on this blog still thinks it is the players.
If this coach does not get his marching orders, I fear for the club.
It defies belief that he is still here, and threatening to have the final say on signings.
Listen to the manager of the bottom club. ” there was no shape or game plan to be seen from them”
“them” in this case was us!
Read it and weep, because everyone who was there in the wind and rain had already decided that he was right.
The general opinion was that the bottom club was superior to us, which of course, being supporters, meant we thought that they were worth a draw.
I am sorry to tell you that they were well worth the win.
Like most hopeless cases, their habit is to shun success, just when you think that the corner is turned, it is a dead end.
Today should be his Swan song, and a fitting end to his inglorious reign.
It has been dominated by a stream of nonsense pouring from him which would have shamed someone running a works team.
If there are six major points which matter in the running of a serious club, he is batting nil. And is beginning to flounder.
Lewis Wing having his worst game !
Will Leeds declare?
Comment that Britt is sat on the pitch, if Britt is in trouble for any time then Boro are in big trouble.
Clearly, being 4-0 down just outside the bottom three is not in big trouble.
Agony for the Boro supporters with a continuation of the first half comments from the Leeds commentators culminating in – – I cant tell you how bad Boro have been.
Lucky to get away with a 4-0 defeat.
So what now?
Can this manager and his staff get enough points to escape relegation?
If I was a gambling person I’d have to say- no.
Perhaps the main chance is if there are three other teams being as bad.
Philip
Boro weren’t even second best today against Leeds and were poor from the off and the result never looked in doubt. Just that daisy-cutter from Tav’s free kick straight at the keeper was on target and it looked like 11 players going through the motions – albeit slow motions.
The passing was poor and that was epitomised by Lewis Wing, who I can’t remember doing anything but misplace passes and giving the ball away. Perhaps only Fletcher had a decent game and Tav for effort. I don’t recall Saville doing anything of note and that £7m looks less than well spent with every game he plays – also what on earth possessed anyone to buy Bola as he’s barely League One standard.
The gamble on Britt’s fitness looks like it may have made it worse and perhaps other will be possibly have one eye on the treatment room to escape too. The only positive was that Luton and Huddersfield were well beaten too and perhaps Boro can hope to be just the fourth worst team in the league. Even the Riverside Live feed gave up on several occasions before just giving up altogether. This is not a season that’s going to be easy to view.
My only comment for now is that the result was not unexpected although the manner of defeat appears disappointing.
I will await RRs report with interest before further comment and in the meantime, I have a nice bottle of Malbec which has my name on it for this evening!
Watched match on a dodgey feed and as WM said we weren’t even 2nd best, 1 shot and target says it all think Leeds goalie fell asleep during the match, I know Leeds are top and marching on together evidently but we were utter dross
Woeful display by Boro and biggest defeat at Elland Road for 42 years. Luckily all the other results except for Barnsley went Boro’s way.
So now we, the supporters, are spending our time looking at who is worse, and that’s really bad, than us for survival. We can keep on being useless as long as three other teams are more useless than us then we’ll be OK and ready for another season of agony because look I kept us up. How did it ever come to this?
There are hints towards the last spell in the old Third Division but I don’t think that this management/coaching set-up would be able to get us out of ‘Division One’. We certainly haven’t got a Stan Anderson or a Bruce Rioch hidden anywhere.
They are clueless, utterly clueless and the ability to inspire, well, what is that?
I also noticed that there were no post on social media from the EG team until the end?
Time for a pint of Abbot and steeling myself to read Redcar Red’s report. I’ll leave that pleasure until the morning.
UTB, one day,
John
Well a nightmare, car crash, call it what you will from the start to the end.
Whilst many of us did not expect to get anything from the game it was the manner of the defeat that was hard to take.
It real showed how far we have sunk as a club and team when compared to the same fixture last year.
No real fight, pedestrian when going forward, failure to make any real impact in the final third and defensively pulled all over the place.
As others have said, Wing had his worst game since being introduced to the team. Given his recent performances he is only making the team due to a lack of competition. McNair is now suspended for the Charlton game and BA is not looking as if he will make it. At this rate JW and RK may have to get their boots on.
Have the other results favouring us resulted in another stay of execution for JW? 😎
There’s always hope in football but most games have fairly predictable outcomes. Realistically there was only ever going to be one winner today and the only issue was how much they would win by.
To an extent, Woodgate is on a hiding to nothing: today showed how far backwards we have gone in the last 15 months when Leeds were lucky to scrape a 0-0 draw against us. Sure Woodgate was dealt a weak hand but he has played it poorly.
I think Gibson also assumed that the squad is still strong enough to keep us up no matter who managed it. He’ll probably be proven right. Win against Charlton and we’re probably still on track to survive by the skin of our teeth.
It would be really interesting to know, just how interested Mr Gibson is???
Yes we all get FPP, but to cut to the extent that we have and appoint a totally inexperienced Coach to boot is nothing more than stupidity and arrogant to believe one could get away with the whole process.
He said nothing at the end of last season, nothing at Woodgate’s appointment and nothing to-date. Does that really sound like an interested Owner?
I think there are some mitigating factors as regards our last three games: – Johnson’s stupid sending-off against Hull (even if Woodgate compounded that error with his second-half tactics); injuries and appalling conditions against Barnsley; a significant number of injuries today against Leeds. Add to that the fact that clubs around us also mostly fared poorly today.
Those factors may well give Woodgate a stay of execution, though if Gibson was at Elland Road today he may well have been very concerned at the apparent manner of the defeat. ( I wasn’t there, btw, but am just reacting to all the reports and people’s comments.)
However, crunch time can’t be far away. I can’t see us picking up many points at Forest, Swansea or West Brom, so home wins versus Charlton and Stoke are absolutely vital. Failure to pick up enough points in those two games, and/or a widening gap to the safety places, must surely result in Gibson firing Woodgate. The manager hasn’t got many last chances left.
The truth is even given the poor hand dealt to him by Mr Gibson, Jonathan Woodgate has not made the best of of it.
One cannot but wonder how many more points we may have picked up in our early games if he had started the season playing five at the back?
But no, JW was going to give us a treat worth seeing…….adventurous attacking football. Until he fell flat on his face.
My opinion is still the fault of where we are lays firmly at Mr Gibson’s new front door.
If Woodgate isn’t fired by mid December then I would expect that Gibson will keep him until at least the end of the season. Why ? I think that a new manager (and team) would need at least a couple of weeks to formulate what needs to happen in the January window, so looking at the fixtures the next home game 7 Dec against Charlton could be the defining match. Anything other than a win could force Gibson to act, if nothing has already been going on in the background.
The 3 home fixtures in December are games we need to win, I am disappointed that he played Paddy and Britt because we are now without one and possibly both for the Charlton game. It is pointless Woodgate saying the players told me they wanted to play, he is the manager and should be able to see the bigger picture and manage the selection of the team based on where he thinks he is going to get the points we need to stay up. If a player comes up to him on Friday and says “Boss, I don’t fancy playing tomorrow against Charlton” is he going to say “ That’s ok, have the day off and go Xmas shopping with your partner”.
Bearing in mind our financial situation, I have heard people suggest getting Chris Hughton in as manager, what are the thoughts on him or any other reasonable suggestions.
Come on BORO.
I think the problem with Hughton would be his salary expectations and also his budget which I’m guessing he would want upwards of £20M as a minimum other wise he knows he would be on a hiding to nothing, the same goes for Jokanovic.
Its the reason we ended up with Woodgate, nothing to do with PowerPoint (I doubt he would know how to prepare and present slides in any case). He was willing to put his name to the signings of Browne, Dijksteel and Bola which is now obvious was the work of our much heralded scouting team and therein lies another reason why a top Manager wouldn’t remotely consider us with that lot to rely on. Pulis cost and spent up what was left and the cupboard is now well and truly bare.
I think the like of Nigel Adkins might consider the role but with caveats that I suspect SG wouldn’t be comfortable with or agree to.
Exmil
A good post and one which flummoxed me as I had always felt that you were very much a supporter who would err on the side of the club. Prepared to see the positives in all situations whilst I would often take the opposite view.
I agree that JW’s naivety was exposed today and failing to rest PM & BA looks as if we are in a more serious situation for the Charlton game, with one if not both sidelined.
I also agree that if JW is not dispensed with by mid December then SG has decided that he will give JW a full season even if that encompasses relegation which is becoming more and more likely.
If he does dispense with JW then I see the simplest option as being to ask TP to undertake an interim role with the task of avoiding relegation and then appointing a new manager in the summer. Not ideal but sometime needs must and he at least knows most of the squad.
If he goes for a new manager now, then he has got to get to know the existing players + wheel and deal during the January window.
I would have preferred CH over JW at the start of the season but believe he sees himself as a premier league manager and as such is unlikely to come unless SG is prepared to throw money at him/the squad.
If I am totally honest, I am not sure who could get this bag of misfits to perform.
I said from the outset that JW had been given a poisoned chalice and whilst he has understandably made mistakes, the players have not covered themselves in glory and it is not all JW’s fault as some posters would suggest.
At present, I am appalled at what has been allowed to happen at our club. 😎
Well despite that rare victory in midweek it’s perhaps still not safe to come out from behind the sofa after all. Indeed, you’d better keep that cushion handy so that your screams won’t disturb the neighbours or wake up small children. Anyway, one man who wasn’t sitting comfortably has just finished preparing the story that unfolded at Elland Road. OK, where shall we begin – it’s Redcar Red with his match report…
https://diasboro.club/2019/11/30/leeds-4-0-boro/
Tomorrow, I’ll read it tomorrow. I’m feeling a little raw and sandpapered at the moment. Even after three cans of Abbot Ale. That’s 5% ABV by the way and no lemonade to top them off.
When will somebody react? They are clueless.
UTB,
John
Me too Although 3/4 of the way through a bottle of red! Maybe better to read it now so it won’t seem as bad!
Oh, I think it will…
Brilliant RR. Thank you.
If anybody had any doubts, today was the end. It was embarrassing beyond belief. The players are not playing for JW that is without question. But what about the rest of the backroom team. What are they doing. Nothing to help the current situation that’s for sure .This is so sad for the supporters. How the hell has it got so bad as this. The whole club is a mess and rotten to the core, from the top to the bottom. I have got to the stage now where I couldn’t care less what happens.
Many thanks RR your reports are really part and parcel of this blog and we truly appreciate your endeavours
OFB
I’ll probably get pelters for this – but what is Karanka up to nowadays?
Probably the only experienced manager I can think of who may take over, after all he has bugger all to lose given our woeful form.
In case that wasn’t clear enough – i think Woodgate has had more than enough time and has proved himself wanting in almost every aspect.
Thanks again RR, after reading your report I saw the shutters coming down faster than a Dingle dollar trial failure
( I’m a celeb get me out of here ) think I’ll join them.
Thanks RR.
What a pity it is that your own dedication, intelligence, analytical ability and strategic awareness, evident in all of your reports and contributions to this blog, are so sorely lacking within the organisation and management of the football club.
You, like many others on here, saw our present parlous situation coming a long time ago.
Those who are in control of the club have not simply failed to see the writing on the wall. They are the graffiti ‘artists’ who put it there.
Quite literally they do not know the first thing about running a football club.
Because the first thing – the most important decision, to which all else is subsidiary- is to appoint the best and most appropriate manager you can.
Woodgate’s appointment, for which the man himself should shoulder no blame, was an act of the most incredible stupidity. Incredible because pretty well the whole of Teesside recognised it as such whilst apparently no one within the club could do so. Stupid, because the unrealistic expectations and PR puffery placed upon the manager were not matched or reflected by anything in his past experience or CV. Indeed he had no managerial CV.
One of Mr Gibson’s most trusted lieutenants and, God help us, the club’s Head of Recruitment made his name in PR. The predictable results are there for all to see. And they have been made worse by the pathetic PR attempts to pull the wool over supporters’ eyes.
No offence to RR, I listened to the match then prepared a rather substantial meal for the family and do not want indigestion. I am sure his report will be painfully accurate as yet again he refuses to report on our thrilling football and 3-0 win away from home.
A good nights sleep and a coffee are what is needed. If anyone needs my recipe for Lamb Shoulder Shepherds Pie just ask, it is more satisfying then listening to a commentary on MFC.
Ian
After 8 weeks of not having a drink I listened to the Radio switched off after Bamfords goal
Mrs OFB had mad a spicy lasagne with fresh minced steak and I said sod the medication and opened a bottle of Barolo
Utter Bliss
And bolloxxx to the Boro !
OFB
Sadly I fear that Woodgate is here to stay for a while yet.
Sacking him now is essentially Gibson, Bausor et al holding their hands up and admitting “we got it wrong”. All the noises coming out of the club are that the people at the top aren’t ready to admit that. Classic sunken cost fallacy.
It’s a pity because as the great Brian Clough said, when you’ve made a mistake with signing a player the best thing that you can do is admit it and move him on as quickly as possible. The same applies to managers. The time to act is now whilst there is still time. Yet I fear that there is zero succession planning in place and Bausor and co will make another awful appointment. But any action is surely now better than inertia.
Woodgate as been given a pair of scissors and told to cut the grass with them.
Lets hope woody goes on garden leave then
OFB
If we were looking to make a case for having a new manager I wouldn’t be disappointed if they gave Phillip Neville the job,
He seems the right kind of forward thinking young manager like the current men’s England manager. What’s his name Southgate ?
Why don’t we appoint Southgate then?
Oh we did that did we ?
Or why don’t we have a former England manager like Steve McClaren?
Oh he left us as well did he?
Why not have someone with a bit of experience then like that nice Mr Pulis?
Oh we got rid of him as well did we ?
I know let’s appoint a CEO who knows a lot about transportation and shipping and nothing about football!
Oh we did that did we ?
Let’s appoint a PR man to not do PR instead we’ll put him in charge of player recruitment!
Oh we did that too mmm!
Then I think I’ll be like Steve Gibson !
I give up !!!
OFB
It certaily hasn’t gone to the plan after Woodgate was appointed. But he had more coaching experience than when Southgate or Jack Charlton was appointed. Or Robson.
And about as much coaching experience as there was when McClaren or Karanka was appointed. So there seems to be a pattern in the appointments at Boro.
The biggest problem in the past few years have been landing our targets in the transfer market. It seems difficult if we are not going to pay over the odds as we – and Pulis – have learned in the past.
Mr Gibson has been forced to overspend in transfer fees as well as salaries. See the Monk era as a good example but it has happened in the past far too often.
We used to buy good but old players without any reselling value in the McClaren era. It looks like a lot of players do not want to come to Boro for the right reasons as Mr Pulis said.
The match was awful yesterday but the second goal came in just about the worst moment. But winning and loosing two matches gets us more points than just drawing the two.
It was bad but let’s hope we can see a quick recovery next. That is the most important thing now. We must get over the heavy defeat – even it was aginst the Dirty Leeds – and we must get a point or three next Saturday.
Still, up the Boro,!
Jarkko, Karanka and in particular McClaren had far more coaching experience and far more responsibility in their coaching roles than Woodgate had. Both had all their qualifications. Karanka worked for Mourinho for years and McClaren worked with experienced managers such as Jim Smith and Ferguson. I understand giving the likes of Karanka and McClaren a go. I don’t understand giving a rookie even in coaching terms such as Woodgate the keys to the car.
I agree that McClaren had experience with Ferbuson and a year or two longrer. But Woody had one and half seasons with Pulis, a very expreinced manager, too.
So the pattern is there, though. Up the Boro!
Mr Gibson will not not sack Woodgate for two reasons IMO.
As mrmisanthtopeblog and others have said, it would leave far far too much egg on face, just something I cannot see Mr Gibson contemplating.
Also as we are more or less broke, or tied to the FFP limit, as cheap as Woodgate and his staff are, the cost of paying them off, three years was it. Then employing a new Manager/Coach on another 2/3 year contract. Unaffordable unless we found a short term fix until the season end.
Even that would probably mean selling one or two of the better players to fund some mote necessary incomings.
Thanks for your match report RR. Even though I was not present today, I know that your report is always a very accurate summary of a match, so I know our performance was abject today. Love that even when the fare on offer is so poor you still rise above it all and manage to bring more than one wry smile to my face with your writing.
Good recipes for shepherd’s pie welcome are welcome in these parts Ian. What with Boro failing badly and the only realistic two options to be PM to lead our divided isle being a pair of mealy mouthed weasels, taking solace in food and drink seems the positive thing to do at times like this.
I have no idea what to think of things in MFC land. Probably the only thing I do think is that whatever action gets taken my the executive to salvage the season will be taken too late to avoid what is becoming to look like the inevitable.
Not been down for a match yet this season, and currently can’t see the incentive do so. Very sad.
The irrationally positive side of being a supporter does keep the flames flickering inside me that our team will suddenly find a run of good results and we will save ourselves. However as each week passes those flames die back a little more and it won’t be long before they are just glowing embers.
JW needs experienced support now, not in a month’s time. To avoid appointing a wise old head to guide and mentor him would appear to indicate that the executive really doesn’t care. But maybe it does care, but just doesn’t care enough to know when to act before it is too late.
I’m ranting now so time to stop cos I just don’t have anything positive to contribute.
Powmill,
I admire your optimism. I’m afraid I can only see grey ashes.
UTB,
John
Redcar Red,
There, I’ve read and it was awful reading but fine reporting. Thank you. However, it did highlight and show up one massive and major tactical error by Boro that you mentioned in the last paragraph. The bus was parked in the car park. What the hell was it doing there, it was supposed to be on the pitch.
An unbeaten run comes to an end.
UTB,
John
Sadly, what I listened too wasn’t some old fashioned radio horror story. Redcar Reds blisteringly accurate and depressing report nailed the current malaise.
McNair and Johnson missing due to suspension, maybe Britt joining the injury list.
Can it get any worse, yes, Gestede could be fit.
I think most of us fully realise that Woodgate is just the tip of the MFC Iceberg. Removing him and replacing him with a more experienced Manager would help to mitigate the car crash that we are now witnessing but it would only be a sticking plaster.
The problems at the club lie far deeper. Who on earth would have remotely thought that Woodgate would be a successful Manager and I disagree with Jarkko about comparing him to the likes of Charlton and Southgate for the reasons I mentioned in the summer. If anyone disagreed about the intellect debate, just listen to his interviews and its pretty obvious that he isn’t the sharpest knife in the drawer. Lets be honest if he was the lad wouldn’t have accepted the role in a million years so he made the perfect fall guy.
This Summer was a poorly thought through and even more poorly executed Spin job come June. It was cringe worthy and embarrassing made worse by many damaging their professional credibility by either being sucked in or stupid enough not to see through it. My guess is that they were probably baited and stupidly fell for it without thinking why the sudden change? It worked at the time to some degree albeit very short lived as our very own OFB and his Season Card can testify but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time.
Robbo never exactly came across as mastermind but he was given a war chest to spend on Players that were on another planet for Boro (and most other clubs at the time). Imagine if Gareth Bale and an ageing Ronaldo had been unveiled in the Summer! If Woodgate had been given in today’s terms probably circa £200M to buy who he wanted even he could probably get some decent players in from around the world (with the caveat that our recruitment team were not in any way involved) but a twelve year old in front of his gaming desktop could do the same. Robbo himself was one huge reason why Players would come to Boro who otherwise wouldn’t have had a clue where to even find us on the map. Woodgate was never in the same class as Robbo despite largely unfulfilled potential and he hasn’t had two brass farthing’s to rub together in his war chest.
When you fix problems in any business you have to trace the problem right back to its source and kill off the root cause otherwise it will just keep reappearing. Dealing with the symptom won’t fix it if the source hasn’t been addressed. Karanka, Agnew, Monk, Pulis and Woodgate are the symptoms, all have failed at some point and in part it was their own undoing but who brought in Guedioura and who sanctioned paying those ridiculous fees for Gestede/Saville/Fletcher etc. Who brought in “gifts” like Downing and Rhodes when it was clear that they weren’t wanted?
Who sanctioned Brad Guzan and the Midget with the medals and an attitude to boot? Who seriously thought that all those decisions would be a good business proposition? Who sanctioned McNair’s fee only to see him ignored for a Season and then was willing to splash more cash that we didn’t have on Besic (thankfully his agent helped us dodge a bullet), bought Saville and then brought in Mikel when we were skint let alone selling Bamford and then paying a ridiculous loan fee for Hugill? Who thought a squad full of defensive midfielders and no marks was the way to go when fans had identified the mercurial No. 10 as the most desperately needed piece of the jigsaw and who we still haven’t recruited all these years and windows later!
Who on earth would remotely think that the continuation of such extreme dysfunctional eccentricities had any Commercial common sense and would end in any way other than it has? I think getting rid of Woodgate may give us a better chance of survival but the lifeboat is leaking like a sieve regardless of whose hand we place on the tiller. Woodgate is just the latest symptom, not the root cause.
Only one answer there RR………one Mr Gibson has his hand firmly on that rudderless tiller.
RR, I agree with you. And I was just trying to paint a picture, too how we ussually hire a new manager. Generally, I like the idea to give a chance to a youngish manager. Monk was seen as a one at the time, too.
Also I agree that Woody is not the problem but symptom. And some rookies might fail like Monk, but mostly they have been OK at Boro in my opinion. Like Robson, McClaren and Karanka. Even Southgate if you look at him now.
So I am still open-minded about Woody. He is a bit like Southgate – none of them were given much money to spend. OK, Southgate bought an expensive Brazilian striker (had he scored about ten goals the season we were relagated ….).
I just keep on supporting. Cannot do more. Up the Boro!
Couldn’t put it any better RR
Thanks RR for your report which made depressing reading but accurately reflected what we watched and cringed through yesterday.
Not much else to say as your report and subsequent post at 9.04 says it all and particularly that our woes go much further than just the manager and players.
Given what has gone before, I see little changing for the good in the near term.
Just one point re the Bamford handball and delayed booking. Despite not being a fan of Keith Stroud’s refereeing, I think he got the decision right albeit not sure if he saw it or was alerted to it be the linesman. I think he allowed play to continue and deliberately waited for a stoppage, which was two or three minutes later, before issuing the yellow card. 😎☹️
You are probably right about Keith Stroud KP but after Preston and the Ayala sending off I had the hay bales burning and my pitchfork already out in preparedness.
Great report RR. You must have a strong constitution to watch the match and then relive it blow by blow as you type up the report. My personal thanks for your steely skinned effort.
On the plus side the internet was much better and the commentary very entertaining, the down side well, we all know what that is – being forced due the cultural brainwashing of my youth to endure 2 hours of slaughter in glorious HD.
The match wasn’t that bad – top of the table at home to relegation strugglers. It was a classic – problem was we were the relegation strugglers, the cannon fodder, the proverbial lambs, and it was painful to watch.
Second half? to be honest – I didn’t care – I was able to detach myself from years of hope and conditioning that somehow things were going to be all right- Cheering on for Paddy Bam Bam to get a hat trick!
So great match for anyone not a Boro fan.
Based on the last 3 matches performances I think we should be able to average 6 points from the bottom 6, a point per game from the rest of the lower half and sweet FA from the others.
So the best we will muster will be 35 points. Will that be enough you cry – only God knows is the answer, but I suspect he will tell us pretty soon.
As for changing the coach – forget it. It is what it is and we will have to start our premiership campaign coming quickly through the ranks of League 1 – where most of our players will feel more comfortable.
On a more lively note I am planning to be at the Riverside for the Luton game in February which should be lively affair – as both teams will be locked into their death spiral as they struggle to avoid the trap-door. It will be my youngest’s first ever Boro match so I will be getting him ready for his lifetime disappointment curse, plus of course some souvenirs from the Boro shop.
Anyhow once again thanks RR.
I admire your optimism Allan that these players can cut it in League One next season. Sadly I think we will keep on sinking, there is nothing whatsoever to provide hope or optimism to the contrary.
Our Academy produces say one decent player every five years or so being kind maybe two (depending on what you consider “decent”). Our Coaching team clearly have no in game management skills and those skills that they do possess are obviously very limited.
50% of that squad will be gone, the best (and also the highest earners) but who do we replace them with and who gets to choose? Remember we sold Bamford because we were skint but then went out and splashed the same cash on Saville, those people?
The last time we were in a similar state it was Mogga who brought in Leadbitter, Dimi, Adomah, Friend etc. and even Ayala (albeit just after he had gone). The last time we were in a mess of this magnitude where Steve Gibson now has us headed once again it was Bruce Rioch that pulled rabbits out of hats. Where do we get a Bruce Rioch from?
There is one positive I suppose in that if we are in League One, financials will decree that all the sycophantic hangers on will likely have to be jettisoned which is some comfort in that they are now effectively the architects of their own inept downfall. They probably don’t have the collective intellect to realise that yet bless them, at least there will be some bargains to be had from the local BMW dealership come June 2020.
Well where does one start with regards to that debacle yesterday, other than to say a big thank you to RR, for his continued fortitude, especially having to write about the same deficiencies from the Coaches and Players. I do not even feel the pain anymore after watching the dross normally served up and after watching yesterdays my only thought was, ah it is Saturday, gin and tonic night. How sad is that.
One try’s to have some positive thoughts, but that is getting harder and harder. I just do not see anything changing as a number of us on here have said. Even Woodgate is now shouting for replacements in January, saying that Mr Gibson and myself are on the same page in respect of incoming players when the window opens.
Who is he trying to kid? If we do bring anybody in it will have to be after we have sold those that could possibly save us from the probable drop. What do we do about Randolf and Ayala? The former we could just about get by without I think, but Ayala, I don´t think so. And that is the problem, will he wait until the summer and leave on a free….probably, or does Mr Gibson try and get 3mil for him and reinvest it on more Bola´s and Browne´s?? Because those are the only players likely to come and those from League 1 where we are headed.
The current scenario painted better by Redcar Red is right out of a horror novel. Hard to believe but it turns out to be true. One could not write a story like the one that is unfolding at MFC, not unless you a very imaginative mind.
Very disturbing that we are making a case for (reluctantly) leaving our illustrious coach in situ.
This is horror film stuff, he is the cause of most of the pain we are suffering.
To be part of a dressing room upheaval when we were in the race for the Prem. Check. To be left in post as we joined Prem, check.
To continue same as we fought to stay in Prem. check.
To finally get rid of Manager as we struggled before Xmass.check
To keep job as we suffered a collapse of manager (several) and imploded. Check.
To be appointed Manager against a chorus of screams from the supporters. Check
To show no talent whatsoever (in line with expectation) Check.
To come under attack from his victims (the fans)Check.
To show his true colors with an exhibition of arrogance, ignorance, and general unpleasantness (plus no knowledge whatsoever of tactics or strategy) Check.
I’m afraid his race is run, it’s over, this is a dead parrot, it is no more. I expect to hear that the farce is over tomorrow.
At lest give these clowns a chance of getting into an Xmass panto.
Did anyone see the 0-2 goal via Riverside Live yesterday? My stream freezed a minure or so before and I followed the match only at the beginning od the second half.
I don’t remember having streaming problems with Riverside Live before.
Up the Boro!
Unfortuanately Jarrko I saw all the goals live in play. I did have some streaming issues but they where later in the game when I had lost interest somewhat.
The pressure is mounting on JW, if MFC decide to pull the plug on his tenure, then it won’t be until they have a replacement in place. The option of removing him and appointing a caretaker manager isn’t there as we don’t have a viable candidate.
Obviously Robbie Keane would leave with JW, ( he’s only part time anyway) and with the best will in the world Leo Percovich is not an option. I would imagine that SG is monitoring the situation and keeping abreast of things. He has a track record of pulling the trigger when he feels it necessary, witness the removal of Mowbray, which to some fans was akin to the dispatching of “Old Yeller”.
The main reason for the position the club finds itself in is that an inexperienced manager was too slow to react to the ineffectiveness of his tactics. Take away yesterday’s result and see recent performances have slightly improved due to a change of team formation. Unfortunately those changes came too late.
When you are sliding down a hill it’s better to apply the brakes sooner rather than later, this means you don’t have so far to climb back up again. This matter of recruitment is nothing new with the club, it’s been a major problem for a long time.
The major problem in our recent Premiership debacle was a lack of attention to fixture management. We knew that the run in games were against teams we had little or no chance of gaining the points needed to avoid relegation so point accumulating against probable fellow strugglers should have been a priority. Yesterday was a prime example, the chance of getting anything from the game was highly unlikely and should have resulted in a team selection to suit.
If JW is to continue in his job then an experienced person needs to be drafted in to help him. There’s no shame in accepting help when you are struggling due to inexperience.
Bring in McClaren!
OFB….he has no nothing and I do mean nothing in his last number of appointments.
If Mr Gibson where to bring somebody in, as I posted earlier, and IMO he will not. then that is akin to saying you are not good enough and therefore you may as well sack him. I do accept that if JW would accept help and the embarrassment that went with it, somebody else would be the cheaper option until the season ends and the miracle of escaping relegation.
Quique Sánchez Flores, anyone? That was said with tongue firmly in cheek, by the way. 😉
Middlesbrough FC have been in this position before. Bobby Murdoch took over from John Neil after the break up of a team that had lost to Wolves in the FA Cup and promptly got Boro relegated after his one and only full season, 1981/82. He was sacked in September 1982 and the club were “lucky” enough to appoint Malcolm Allison though with similar restraints
as today with little cash to buy new players. He became frustrated when told to sell Darren Wood by the chairman Mike McCullagh but refused with his parting statement that “It’s better for the club to die than to linger slowly on its deathbed”.
Boro then appointed Willie Maddren as assistant manager to former manager Jack Charlton who agreed to take charge until Maddren had found his feet. Boro escaped relegation by the skin of its teeth on the last day of the season with a win at Shrewsbury. By the following December McCullagh and fellow director Peter Cook resigned and in came Alf Duffield, but by the following February with Boro in the bottom 3, Maddren was sacked because he protected a lot of his youngsters by not playing them in a struggling team. However it was felt at the time that he was let down by some senior members of the squad who couldn’t wait to get away at the season’s end.
Like Woodgate, Maddren was thrilled to be appointed manager, but described his parting as the saddest day of his life with the words “For the first occasion in my life I hadn’t been unsuccessful and that hurt”. There was enough talent in the team but some of that talent didn’t care enough about staying. Bruce Rioch, a member of the coaching staff, took charge but this time the final match of the season, ironically again at Shrewsbury was Boro’s death knell and relegation. We all know what happened next with liquidation and Boro rising like a Phoenix from the Ashes. Does all this sound like deja-vu? But where is the next Bruce Rioch coming from, or on the field the next Tony Mowbray, Garry Pallister, or Bernie Slaven for that matter when we may have to sell our better players come January?
Thanks again to Redcar Red for his report, but it must have been as painful to record as it was to be reminded of. By a strange twist of irony my iPad refused to allow me into any websites this morning, and after affirmation from Virgin Media that all was well at their end, I spent 40 minutes on the phone to
Apple who guided me through how to rectify the position but didn’t know why it had occurred. I guess it must have been a long suffering Boro fan who had lost the will to live.
No point in bringing anyone in to help JW. We need a clean sheet. What about no nonsense Neil Warnock until the end of the season ?
The blog makes very gloomy reading and the nights are drawing in. The bad news is
that post Christmas Slump will be on us soon.
Everyone forgetting the six straight defeats last season, with THESE same players.
Problem is , a coach is one thing a manager is different.
The Manager should be someone , who first can recognise a player of the quality you need ,you then must understand a system that gets the maximum out of him, which means were any player is comfortable in the position he plays. You must also understand quickly any player not up to the task, and get rid.
A coach through the manager implements the training that produces the shape.
Of course it helps if the owner of the club, realises his scouting or recruitment team are so bad , he smashes them out of the club forever.
Well, I have finally come out from behind the sofa to read RRs report in the knowledge that it is not long until wine o clock again!
I’m am sure RR needed several stiff drinks whilst reliving the game and he deserves our thanks for doing that. As usual it was delivered in a professional and entertaining way – it is just a pity that the team we support can’t do the same.
From reading all the comment on here, it would appear that despite it being December, there is little Christmas cheer and we are all pretty despondent regarding our position.
Whilst, as Ken says, we have been in similar positions before, this time, with the change in the way football is, the position is far more serious. To get out of the old Division 3 would be extremely hard, coupled with an owner who does, on the face of it, appear to have lost a degree of interest.
I am sure someone will be able to let us know how many games he has seen this season and if it is even all the home games, then I am prepared to be pleasantly surprised. If not, then, maybe that tells it own story.
The appointment of JW kinda made some sense to me at the time although as the season has progressed, I have come to the conclusion that he is the wrong man for the role of manager. Now, he may be a good coach although based in the tactics seen thus far, I am not sure of that but he is not a good manager as evidenced by his post match comments. A more experienced manager would be more careful with what he said.
Should SG relieve JW of his duties, probably once we have a replacement in place. Will SG actually do that, I don’t think he will as it will prove, yet again, that he has made a mistake and I am not sure he would want to admit to that so soon after the GM fiasco.
We are where we are and it will be what it is.
UTB – the Boro’s going………..
Fill in the missing word of your choice – answers on a postcard please
I’m not saying that if Boro are relegated this season that it will be easy to get promotion the following season as Division 1 has become as competitive as the Championship. But consider these statistics from the last 5 seasons:-
RELEGATED 2015/16
Millwall promoted 2 seasons later via the playoffs
Wigan promoted the following season
RELEGATED 2016/17
Charlton promoted 3 seasons later via the playoffs
Bolton promoted the following season
RELEGATED 2017/18
Blackburn promoted the following season
Wigan promoted again the following season
Rotherham promoted the following season via the playoffs
Therefore all 3 relegated teams were promoted in the following season.
RELEGATED 2018/19
Barnsley were the only club to gain promotion in the following season
There is a pattern here that clubs relegated often become yo-yo clubs between the 2 Divisions. Nevertheless of the 12 clubs relegated in those 4 seasons, 8 managed to get promoted within 3 years. Ipswich may follow that trend, but there’s no guarantee that Sunderland will. In the past it has taken the likes of Sheffield United and Leeds several seasons to regain that status and Sheffield have already reached the Premier League and Leeds may well join them next season. I’m not saying that Boro will be able to do that, but it is possible. I only offer these statistics as a guide, so please don’t shoot the messenger.
I can’t remember but did I ever mention on here how much I thought that selling Bamford at the time was a disastrous mistake that pained me greatly? Suffice to say it pained me far more yesterday, still at least Tony Pulis was able to buy Saville and Flint with the proceeds so its not all bad news ;-(
Love the humor! Had me LoLing
RR, the decision to sell Bamford is one off the worst decisions ever taken by Middlesbrough Football Club.
I was watching goals on Sunday on sky TV and one of the guests with Chris Kamara was Alex McLeish (ex Birmingham and Villa manager). He was asked what he had been doing and what does he see for his future, his reply was “I have been going to lots of games and enjoyed the time out of the pressure cauldron but I think it is time to come back. I see myself as part of the back room staff helping a young manager and being involved in recruitment, where I think a lot of clubs get it wrong”.
I wonder if there is a club looking for someone like that ?
Come on BORO.
I would like to think we were looking for someone like that but Alex McLeish doesn’t inspire me. That said he does have plenty of experience but most of it unfortunately isn’t successful achievement in Football Management.
There again there is always the consideration that we scour Europe again for a top class DOF and the outstanding candidate will be Phil Stamp!
I have just forced myself to read Redcar Red’s report of yesteday’s disaster. I only listened to the match on Radio Tees and even their commentary couldn’t avoid strong criticism so as expected RR’s is true but sad reading. I did manage to keep the bottle of Malbec unopened until the 10th minute of the match and kept about 1/3rd of the bottle to finish while reading the report and comments on Diasboro.
I will be staying at my sister’s at the weekend next weekend so it will only cost £23 to see us play Charlton though I have booked a hotel for the Stoke game. (It is probably good that I can’t get over for Boxing Day.)
I expect us to lose players in January and if we sign anyone on loan/transfer the FFP position will mean they will not be an improvement on the current squad. I am already looking to next season in Div 1 as at best a middle of the table team. Things have gone disastrously wrong in the last few years and am surprised that SG has let it happen and at best his silence suggests that he doesn’t know how to improve things. I don’t expect JW to be sacked as the cost of terminating contracts and bringing in new staff will be too high.
I suspect that if I lived near Middlesbrough I wouldn’t be bothered to go to matches now and it is just my loyalty to “home” that draws me over. My 3 year season card expires at the end of this season and I have already put money aside to renew it and am saving for hotels/rail fares. I don’t think there is a cure for me though eventually the aches and pains of old age may prevent me travelling.
Redcar Red, McLeish May not be a top class manager but isn’t mostly successful might be stretching it a bit. At Rangers he won 2 championships and 5 cups, took Birmingham to the Premiership in 2008, won the league cup with them in 2011. In my opinion he has had more than a reasonable amount of success n his career. I don’t think we will entice Wenger to the northeast but maybe you prefer Pulis, Warnock or even Karanka back. To be honest I have no idea who would be the right fit for club, if they are even thinking in that direction.
Come on BORO.
I doubt Wenger would be interested or we could even afford his right arm. I discount Scottish titles and the like, we know to our cost the standard both of football and Managers up there. Strachan was considered “successful” in Glasgow with Silverware, down here he even took the Saints to an FA Cup Final. He was so far out of his depth at the Riverside it was plain for all to see but at least he done the decent thing and ultimately walked. I would put McLeish well below Strachan in the pecking order if I was making a list of Scottish Managers. I would put McClaren well ahead of McLeish and I am not particularly enamoured by that thought either but if needs must.
I definitely wouldn’t want Pulis back under any circumstances, despite the claims about how careful he was with Steve’s money, the money he wasted was as bad as Monk in my opinion. His Football was numbing and he should have gone after the Villa Play Off debacle or that six game losing streak. Just that substitution of Assombalonga at Home was enough for me to give him his P45. He is the reason I cut off my nose to spite my face and pay walk up prices rather than a Season Card.
Karanka has proved he can do it at this level and has done it recently both with Boro and that veritable basket case Forest. Leagues, tactics and playing styles change very quickly and McLeish’s experience in the Championship is from a decade ago. The dark stain on Karanka was that dressing bust up which over time seems to have been a bit of a Teesside Tommy vendetta going on and I suspect those involved knew they had Steve’s ear and like the “gifts” he didn’t want, his position was being undermined. I would have him back as he did manage to get us up and despite my many frustrations with him over the selecting and positioning of Stuani and Adomah etc. He did at least deliver promotion in the end even if it was a last day nail biting scramble. He was effectively thrown under the bus in the January Transfer Window by incompetence from those above him. Sound familiar?
Warnock has retired to the best of my Knowledge but I would have him here until the end of the season to keep us in this division. Its better to spend the money to stay in than to try and get back as Sunderland, Pompey and dare I say it Bolton have found out or indeed one of Strachan’s former Clubs Coventry. Warnock’s knowledge of the Championship is current and up to date which is important because we don’t have the luxury of a bedding in period.
My preferred realistic choice out of those we could perhaps afford would be Nigel Adkins, he saved Hull last season on a shoestring and could stabilise a club like ours in disarray. He is an intelligent man with knowledge of a lot of aspects within a football club and crucially he has recent relevant experience in the Championship.
Chris Hughton and Jokanovic etc. as many fans believed had been interviewed but whose PowerPoint’s presumably failed to live up to Woodgate’s ability would be nice but like Wenger they are now totally out of our League but for the record Hughton would be my choice, a decent bloke who has done a good job wherever he has been. The big problem as I see it is in finding someone who can work in what at least outwardly looking in now appears to be a somewhat unhealthy narcissistic environment.
I don’t know what or who we can or cannot afford but if I was mortgaged up to the hilt on a property with a leaking roof I know that I would have to find the money somehow to get that roof repaired otherwise my investment would be worthless very soon.
There again the drips through the ceiling could just be lying and I could deny the reality for a few months and the time served Roofer’s quote not meet my budgetary expectations. Besides I know a bloke, Terry the Tiler from Brambles Farm that would do a cheap job for me without all that Scaffolding cost and no questions asked about the Lead for a few pints in the club and a couple of sacks of Pigeon Grain. What could possibly go wrong?
RR
That’s a great post and I enjoyed it especially the leaking roof analogy!
All those points about managers who are available really does boil down to Hughton or Karanka.
I always thought I would never have Karanka back again at the club as I’m aware of the way his autocratic style created deep divisions with the team and players and management
However our leaking roof needs the best tiler we can get and he still lives fairly local at Harrogate.. He will also be aware of some players we could possibly get on loan and if we can also get pay off some dead wood like Gestede then we may have some wriggle room with wages.
We also need to get the likes of Wing playing again as we have totally destroyed his belief in himself and his ability this season and if our squad had not been so short of players he would have been dropped
OFB
Don’t like Adkins
I agree
I agree that you don’t like Adkins! 😎
Are you sure you don’t like Adkins Bob?
I would be fine with Karanka coming back but there would need to be an acceptance of a lot of things that the MFC hierarchy probably wouldn’t like and wouldn’t want to agree to. I don’t like his football but in fairness his Forest side played decent football up here when they gave us a lesson just before he parted company with them.
He was cultured under Mourinho and that means he calls the shots, you have to accept that and support him to get on with it and that means moving out any dissenters regardless of their town of birth. It also means you are paying him to do the job and that means hands off and go take up Golf or something if you feel the need to tinker. The last thing Michelangelo would have wanted was some white robed laurel wreathed all controlling bishop shouting up continually “you’ve missed a bit”!
Maybe he should send his CV in to SG under the name of Ken Ranka, Place of Birth: Easterside near the Burra.
RR
I didn’t like AK at the end but he knows Gibson and the club and he is a tactician
I went for a job once with Citroen and they wanted 2cvs !
OFB
Well, this is another fine mess that we’ve got ourselves into.
Having suggested – along with others – that anyone with a niggle should be rested against Leeds there was no satisfaction in being proved right as Assombalonga and McNair offered very little and are now quite possibly missing for the next game.
With a kick-off at 2.00am Sydney time, I had decided not to watch any of the game but was wryly amused when some mischievous inner part of my psyche decided to wake me up at exactly 2.45am. Just in time to check the half time score and then be dragged into watching the second half. Such are the tricks that our ‘inner Boro’ plays on us. Needless to say it wasn’t a particularly satisfying experience
Rather than dwell on the failings and weaknesses, I thought that it might be more worthwhile to look at some positives, such as they are.
Above all, it seems to be that we are actually capable of producing good quality young players.
When you look at a list including Fry, Pears, Coulson, Tavernier, Liddle, Wood, Walker and others such as Stubbs who are doing well out on loan, that is a solid production line. It does however pose an obvious question at least in the case of Wood. He is the captain of England at whatever level he plays – U19 I think – and yet our management team aren’t prepared to give him a chance alongside Ayala and Fry. Why the hell not. He could have done as well as a 50% fit McNair and would it have mattered if he hadn’t quite lasted. Then McNair could have come off the bench.
Liddle came on and produced a positive cameo. He looks to have cultured left foot and looked to be one of those players who can see the pattern of a game and knows what he wants to do with the ball before it comes to him. With Wing getting worse and worse with every game, why not give him a chance. It might be a very nice surprise and, in the worst case, you can bring Wing off the bench.
Tavernier looks to be turning into a player of real quality. I would play him at the apex of a pyramid playing behind the front player(s).
Ayala is immense and Howson seems to carry on game after game. Really top class professionals.
Anyway, looking forward to the next game, I would suggest that we need to lock down a defensive structure that won’t leak so many goals.
Looking at the players available, I would suggest that we revert to a back four but with one significant difference. The full backs are told that they are not to get caught far forward of the halfway line and never both at once. Quite who plays at full back, I don’t know. It will come down to injuries but I suppose that Howson will be asked to fill in again although I’d like to see him play further forward. Bola appears to be the last man standing on the other side. I would then play Clayton as a central midfield blocking player sitting between and just in front of Ayala and Fry. That structure gives you an effective back five. I would then be tempted to play either a midfield four with Tavernier at the apex with Saville, Liddle and Fletcher or push Fletcher forward alongside Assombalonga. If Assombalonga isn’t fit, then Fletcher has to play forward alone unless they actually want to give one of the kids a chance.
I know that it’s pretty weak but at least it uses what we have.
UTB
Seeing that team Selwynoz does not give me much hope of beating Charlton.
Self inflicted suspensions and injuries and poor tactical management. Just how did we get to this???
My dear Grandmother always used to say, “buy cheap and pay twice”!
That in a nutshell is how we got to this, mind you she never said anything about paying over the odds for cheap and then having to buy twice. I think she just figured that nobody would be that stupid surely.
I totally agree with your grandmother. Did she support Boro, too?
That generation did not either pollute so much. That problem came with the next generation and current ones. We’ll never learn.
UTB!
This brought a smile to my face and I will resist the obvious not wishing to detract from the pleasure in enjoying it.
https://twitter.com/alasdairgold/status/1201191479336689664?s=21
Lovely to see that
Yes brilliant. Watched it with a smile on my face.
Watching it I think that mentally it was a nice gesture but also a massive message from Mourinho to the Players and Supporters alike along with the Employees at the club. His style rubs many up the wrong way but that gesture signified a lot and most important of all it was reactive and genuine.
Three of the goals could have been avoided,
We are missing a real leader at the back ,to organise , they are panicking like a Sunday league team right now.
Nobody is taking charge anywhere on the field. A big problem ,
Its a must we find a couple of players to sort things out.
Don’t forget we are missing Shotton and Friend and any championship team would miss those
OFB
GT
So right, we had no idea, non whatever.
The Leeds fans were shocked at the shambles on display.
If he has given a rank beginner and his mate a three year contract then he is beyond anyone’s help.
Sorry, I know he is a nice fella, but as a fan they invariably turn out to be your worst enemy.
The buying of unscouted rubbish, on a nod and a wink, (long contracts, High wages, all the harbingers of disaster (which is surely coming).
I personally think that our only answer is the immediate rehiring of AK, and anyone who even dares to bleat should be drummed out of the club.
And, before anyone even comments on events at the club, let it be understood that he will build us a defence that is watertight, that is a given.
You crawl before you can walk.
I wonder if that was the reason he started with a super defence, remember the number of clean sheets in a row. I believe we thought it was shameful, and he should have been fired, oops! He was.
Lovely clip unlike the boy at Swansea who lay on the ball so Chelsea couldn’t play on.The job of the ball boy is to get the ball to the players not keep it.
Sometimes there is some sharp practice. Everton were playing ManU and all the ball boys had a ball to do what this lad did at Spurs. Everton scored in the second half and all the spare balls disappeared down the tunnel!
Its like the towels for the throw ins, sharp practices and attention to detail, fine margins and all that. A solitary goal can make or break a teams season, qualification for a tournament, getting through to the next round, winning a trophy or even shudder the thought avoiding relegation.
How many great teams exhibit great sportsmanship, many of us were disappointed at Bamford’s antics of late but look where he is in the League. Ronaldo one of the best of his generation goes down quicker than a certain Hotel heiress “allegedly”. We know that Ayala doesn’t always play by the rule book. The Watford Manager got sacked because of an obvious and blatant hand ball. Bremner, Yeats, Stiles, Chopper Harris all excelled in the dark arts. A winning mentality is all about winning, nice wins you nothing.
If our Ball Boys (sorry maybe I should start by saying if we had Ball Boys) were trained and disciplined the marginal advantage they could bring over a season could be worth millions. The state we are in they could influence ever so slightly just one key result that could keep us up or indeed conversely that Brighton game when the margin was as tight as it could possibly be but the riches incredible, well at lest until we got our hands on it and relieved it up the wall of a Rockliffe Pissoir.
Jonathan Woodgate is reportedly facing the sack at Boro, with Neil Warnock in line to replace him. (via The Sun Football)
(📸 via Getty Images)
Brilliant instant analysis from RR at 12.36 am, and a lovely video clip too.
What Adkins would definitely bring to the Boro is at least something which has been lacking from the club for far too long. He is an excellent communicator. He also seems to have an open personality, and a bit of a sense of humour.
This may not seem like much. They are, after all, pretty basic human qualities. But they are attributes that were conspicuously lacking in Karanka, and Pulis, and now (“We go again on Tuesday”) Woodgate. And they do not appear to be there in abundance at executive level within the club.
The results of all of this are there for all to see , and not simply on the pitch. Man management has been an issue within the club for far too long . As has been open and effective communication at all levels with the fans. The bonds within the club must by now be considerably frayed. Those between the club and the fans are close to breaking point, and there seems to be no one at the club with the combined analytical and communication skills, or even the desire, to tell the Teesside public what the hell is going on, let alone offer any realistic vision for the future.
We urgently need a new manager. Someone with a realisable vision, and with the record and experience of seeing it through, no doubt. Someone with football intelligence and tactical know-how. But after all of the linguistic mumblings and fumblings of the past five years, by heavens do we need a leader with the desire and ability to communicate effectively with both his players and the fans.
Adkins may or may not be our man. But he does, for me, at the very least, tick one essential and much under-rated box box.
Correction to “..box box”.
I did of course mean “…box box box”
Happy to clarify since, as I suggested, effective communication should be a top priority.
Nigel Adkins
I think I’ve changed my mind about him
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/nigel-adkins-jonathan-woodgate-future-17308772
OFB
Something to cause a few ripples this Monday Morning:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/10464103/middlesbrough-boss-warnock-woodgate/
The source of it is questionable considering the newspaper’s history but it would also be Typical that the Gazette are sitting on the story under strict instruction not to breath a word.
I was just going to say, ….well no “breaking news”, so I guess that Woodgate is safe for another week?
Yes I’ve posted that as well !
Rather him than Adkins
Revisiting the debate of yesterday and pondering on if we did go down where would we find another Bruce Rioch? Thinking about it I think the nearest present day equivalent would probably be Pearson and in that situation maybe a good fit for fighting our way back out of League One.
When my Cardiff City mate told me that Warnock was joining them when they were in trouble I sad he would do a good job. Not only did he save them but got them promoted.
Not sure on this one. He has openly stated previously that we are a club he would have loved to have managed but never got the call.
He said at the start of the season that this would be his last and then the tragedy of Emiliano Sala’s death clearly took its toll on him so I am not sure if he has had enough of the game.
I would also question, given his early departure from Cardiff, if he is restricted from joining another club.
Then again, it’s a funny old game as someone once said! 😎
Please no!
Sad should be said!
I think in the present environment Pearson would fit now never mind in the summer, I would rather be in with a chance of staying up than be relegated then hoping we get promoted at the first time of asking.
Not sure about Pearson Ian, but we need somebody in. The problem I see, assuming Mr Gibson moved to that, and I do not he will, is that any dcent Manager would probably want the final say on team selection, which as I said previously is tantamount to sacking him or at best sidelining him.
Pearson is a bully and not liked especially by me !
OFB
Maybe a Manager who calls it like it is and won’t himself be bullied or manipulated is exactly what MFC actually need right now?
I can imagine a few tasty recruitment debates with a few home truths being bluntly spoken in frank Anglo Saxon terminology plus a few obsequious hanger on’s who facilitated this mess hiding behind their desks.
He was a great Captain and Leader for the Boro while he was here unlike the current incumbent. Besides his misdemeanours (like many others courted by the club) would surely just add kudos to his PowerPoint? Compared to some alleged incidents and records from those employed previously he almost seems angelic.
This might end the speculation:
https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/middlesbrough-remain-committed-manager-jonathan-17349093
Come on BORO.
All of that is just Phil Tallentire’s opinion. There is not a single thread of supporting evidence and his article quickly goes off on a tangent about the squad being weaker etc. which is the exact opposite to what the Gazette was spinning us in the summer.
Had he said “in a meeting with Steve Gibson this morning when asked about Neil Warnock he burst out laughing and said absolutely not” it might have some weight but in truth its just speculation much in the same vein as the Sun reporter’s original story. If you read the numerous comments below the article (well over 50) they are pretty unanimous in their collective thoughts and its not the response the Club or its Mouthpieces would have wanted.
I have no idea if there is a shred of truth in the Warnock link but I equally see no shred of evidence to the contrary in Tallentire’s article. I also think that it is maybe worth bearing in mind that after two of its journalists were banned and the remaining Gazette journalists had a mini boycott they were very suddenly back on board and being fed information in the Summer. Clearly it was decided that they had a use and on that they were well and truly used. No directly attributable comments or interviews since apart from with the one thrown under the Bus and a few Players tells a story.
If something was going on behind the scenes the Gazette would be bricking it if they broke the news before the official rubber stamp. A National Journalist couldn’t give a Monkey’s about SG or MFC, they are simply tomorrow’s chip paper to him. So if there was something about to break the Gazette would likely be muzzled until approval and consent was given. That would suggest to me that there is a strong possibility that any early “leaks” would come from other sources not under the direct control and influence of the Club.
Having said that if there was something imminent I suspect that the Gazette would be given the green light to turn on Woodgate.
RR – spot on regarding the abrupt change in narrative from the Gazette journalists. When Woodgate was appointed the Gazette were quick to make noises to the effect of ‘we’ll probably fall just short but with a bit of luck we might just sneak into the top 6’. Expectations have been revised down ever since without them admiting or acknowledging it. Just shows the contempt that they hold for their readers. Not a shred of journalistic integrity left. The Gazette is effectively MFC’s Ministry of Truth.
Exmil, it may do that, but what it will not do is stop the calls for his head.
If Woodgate cannot keep us out of the bottom three then those calls will get louder and possibly start on the terraces at the Riverside.
PT’s is just more spin. We have to remember that we have been down at the bottom since the season started. Before we had injuries to FIRST team players. (why do they keep including Gestede?) Before we had red cards.
They keep forgetting to say it took Woodgate a good number of games to realise his tactics were wrong, games against teams that we should of picked up points against. Wrong team selections and wrong tactics.
Pedro if they pointed out the blindingly obvious it would be more than their pens are worth!
That said the comments are making it pretty clear what their readership thinks of the present set up. At some point the Gazette will either have to break ranks or go down with their ship unless SG acts quickly.
we must be the kindest fans in the world.
I know of no others who would suffer what we have suffered and still make comments such as ‘it’s not time to fire him yet’ or the truly unspeakable ‘get an experienced manager to help him’.
Can we agree that it was a bad idea to hire someone who had never managed at any level. Check
That it was equally bad to hire someone who was complicit in upsetting a team on it’s way to promotion. Check
That it was foolish in the extreme to allow him to hire his mate (equally bereft of any idea of management) never heard him utter a word of any sort on any subject. Check
We already knew that his judgement of a player was, at best shaky, at worst non existent. Check
We have all of us commented on his utter lack of any knowledge of tactics. Check
On the same level is his knowledge of coaching, zilch. Check
As for formations, i.e. Defensive or attacking, nope, I think we can clear him of any fancy notions like that. Check.
Unfortunately we have no idea about buying and selling players, he might be a genious? I do not want to find out, it could be an expensive lesson.
I think we should cut to the chase, he must go, and this week. He is doing immense damage to our club. The players are no longer playing for him, and who can blame them?
The fans have got his number.
Gibson can no longer take the attitude that the championship is good enough for us, because it will not be available come spring.
Just the immortal words of the innocent manager of our opponents after the water polo game last week. ” They had no shape, no tactics, no method, no idea.”
He was wrong on one point only, he definitely likes tic tacs. Oops! Sorry.
This was my favourite piece from the article:
“He has three left-sided defenders unavailable – George Friend, Marvin Johnson and Hayden Coulson. As a result Marc Bola had to play at Elland Road and he struggled to cope”
That would be the same Marc Bola who was a significant part of that famous presentation that blew the Senior Executives at MFC away in June and left all those from across Europe in Woodgates wake? The very same Marc Bola who was signed as a Left Back?
Amazing how already recent history is being tweaked and reinterpreted in only a few months while the comments are now up to 70 and rising. If it wasn’t all so painful it would be genuinely pure comedy gold.
FA Cup Third Round Draw.
Boro vs Spurs
That’s our goose well & truly cooked! 🙁
At least we can focus on survival after probably setting a new club record Home defeat.
I think the record currently stands at 0-9 against Blackburn at Home in the League in 1954 but the FA Cup record loss is 1-8 against Hebburn Argyle in December 1896.
I wonder what the odds are on Spurs getting double figures especially considering its their best hope for a trophy this season. If we are lucky that nice Mr. Mourinho might just play his ball boys.
The cup draw is a clear reason why you do not hire a complete novice to manage your club on the basis that they are only in the Champ.
Your club has to field a team good enough to give any Prem Team a game.
It is not going to be unfortunate defeats by bottom clubs (at home)
The mind goes back to the last time we had to play a great team in the cup, true it was away from home, so there was some excuse for us, but it was a great game, and we won.
Still, it was a continental Manager and a great result, I can’t quite remember what happened to him, was it a bunch of players who decided that they simply were not going to be involved in all this big game stuff, next it would be the Prem and where would it all end, and it was hard to play to your handicap if there was going to be all this extra coaching.
This is the message, it must be now, tomorrow, time is of the essence.
O well, at least that means we can concentrate on the league!
No doubt I will struggle to get a ticket ahead of all those loyal fans!
BBB
Please, do not start on the poor old fans who have supported these awful people as they have spouted rubbish that a child would have laughed at, for several seasons.
If the fans turned up in numbers these people would be quoting the old chestnut, our fans are very happy with us, so go away.
When a professional club High in the championship is prepared to allow a training ground rebellion against the Manager, let the rebels stay at the club. He still gets them up.
They are still at the club.
They cheer as the Manager is axed.
They are still at the club.
They are relegated.
The club is near the top of the Champ.
It goes into freefall (no, nobody knows why)
They are still at the club.
One of them is made the Manager.
They are at the bottom of the Champ.
Everybody knows why.
The Manager talks rubbish, to the national press!
They laugh.
The club start whining about injuries.
The Manager still has no idea, in other circles it is known as a full house.
Completely blank on the following; tactics, strategy, formation, talent, dead balls (the traditional refuge of those short on talent).
Motivational skills, never seen any, so difficult to judge.
Team selection, has disproved the ‘ law of averages’ myth, because if there was such a law he would surely have got his selections right at least once.
On current form it will be all over by half-time.
Can’t get enthused, but come January, on a crisp Saturday, with perhaps a touch of Cup fever in the air and probably a new manager…who knows?
Even the most pessimistic of fans will get a buzz out of a home draw in the cup to a top Premiership team. I doubt it will be a sell out, but it should be a great atmosphere.
GHW
This team is simply not capable of giving them a game.
There is a sickness at the heart of the club, and it does mean he must go, now!
On the Warnock link – one of the critcisims that Warnock got at Leeds is that he was only there for half a week because he didn’t want to relocate from the South West (who could blame him!). I therefore think it’s unlikely that he would take on the Boro job. What he could do on a half a week basis is a DoF role. The arch-pragmatist to Woodgate’s naivety and given that Robbie Keane only works for us on a part time basis it shouldn’t be too much of an issue. Worth a go IMO given that all the noises from the club indicate that Woodgate is here to stay.
Miss—
He may stay but the fans certainly will not.
He will find, as all chairmen find, that when the end comes, it is very final.
And quick.
Half a week from Warnock or a full time Woodgate?
It would be better if he could put in half a week every week but right now I’d settle just for half of a week. Seriously if it is just half a week then I’d put Friend as assistant until the end of the season. An experienced Manager and an assistant who knows the club and with a brain cell all to himself could be a deadly combination.
Agree with both Plato & RR here. I think Woodgate has to go but unfortunately I think Gibson et al are gambling that there’ll be 3 teams worse than us and we’ll survive. A dangerous gamble and one that will come back to bite us.
One of those three teams below Boro will put a run together so we must hope and pray that a team above Boro goes into free-fall. For me there are too many ifs, probably, what-ifs, maybes and what-abouts to take it that Boro will be safe.
Major gambling, Russian Roulette anyone? Then there’s the deafening silence from the senior management, not just Mr Gibson.
I just don’t know anymore, the life is just being sucked out of the club and the supporters/support’s passion deflating and interest is dissipating. They don’t seem worried so why should we be? If they can’t see it, well, it must be figment of our collective imaginations.
Pass me my spare fiddle.
UTB,
John
As far as Boro is concerned, I’ve not got much time or enthusiasm beyond watching the games at the moment as I really need to remain focused on a project that’s running two weeks behind schedule and needs completing in three weeks otherwise I will probably be having Christmas in a stable – though that will be a stable condition judging by Mrs Werder’s impatient mutterings and not an out-house fit for anyone guests purporting to be wise (which is not an attribute anyone connected with the club appears to be blessed with).
Anyway, it seems to be becoming the consensus that Woodgate may not be the Messiah and his less than immaculate conception as head coach has become a lot more laboured and painful than anticipated by those who delivered him.
My view is that he is here for a reason and he’s essentially the presence on earth of the all-mighty chairman and god of Teesside. OK, we’re still waiting for him to produce a few miracles and it seems he still can’t cure the sick or feed the 5,000 or so hungry souls that will probably be turning up at the Riverside before he eventually leaves this Boro world.
Basically, he is the chosen one and he was chosen because he has accepted the brief of having no money and will agree to allow players to be sold above his head. Steve Gibson needed someone who buys into downsizing and wouldn’t kick up a fuss as he’s just glad to be given the opportunity. He’s just giving it a go and although he’s a bit naive tactically his mission is to finish in 20th spot.
Indeed, Steve Gibson could have randomly picked anyone in the summer who would probably have finished in 20th place with a squad that still carries a £25m wage bill and enough half decent players left for the chairman to not have seriously contemplated that the club could be relegated.
I believe there was even some loose talk in the summer that the aim was still to finish in the top six but I think that was before season ticket sales had concluded. My view is that Gibson will stick with Woodgate as long as he stays in contention for that 20th spot as he still needs a compliant person in charge to continue the downsizing next summer and possibly allow one or two ‘required’ sales in January.
Boro simply can’t sustain the current wage bill as there is not enough possible income and while there may be some takers for the project, it probably won’t be a job for managers with reputations they’re unwilling to risk (i.e. Pulis didn’t fancy the job once parachute payments had ended) Also that kind of job wouldn’t attract up-and-coming managers either as they wouldn’t want to risk having their careers stalled by having little room to manoeuvre to build their own team.
So Woodgate was probably perfect for the job and will no doubt be still feeling positive about it. Besides you can’t blame him for being inexperienced as that wasn’t a requirement it seems. It’s also no coincidence that he was appointed head coach and not manager as those decisions on sales and incoming players will be made at board level.
In reality this season is already over in terms of anything positive happening. Boro cannot make the play-offs no matter how optimistic you think – it would mean making another 60 points from the remaining 27 games and that task had already gone above the magic 2 points per game we use to measure automatic promotion.
In conclusion, I believe nothing will happen until it looks a lot more desperate than it does now – if Boro beat Charlton next weekend (and they should) then Woodgate will still be in charge until at least Christmas and I suspect nothing will be contemplated until after those festive home fixtures of Stoke and Huddersfield have concluded. If those are negotiated without too much damage then Woodgate will likely still be learning his trade on Teesside for the rest of the season.
Still, having only just reached December, it’s rather depressing that the best that will happen this season is just to avoid relegation – not exactly the inspiring message we were given in the summer when someone said it was was going to be an exciting time to be a Boro supporter!
An excellent summary. I also think Woody was chosen as the best alternative at the time. I don’t believe for a moment that Mr. Gibson would have chosen Woody just because he was local and at the club already. That would be too naive to believe.
Excellent, Werder. Up the Boro!
Great post, Werder, and an excellent example of how the sophistication of language and thought regularly on display on this blog from a very wide range of contributors puts the communication efforts of both the club and the Gazette to shame. At the moment you cannot get material of this kind of quality from any other source. Many thanks.
Werder
Your blog is one more addition to all the similar ones circulating on here.
Any comfort they give is dependent on the belief that we are in the relegation mix by some bizarre and completely random accident which the authorities will put right as soon as they get round to it,
That is a falacy.
When you give a job as manager in a thoroughly professional league, full of players of serious class, managed by people who can and will go on to better things, then you are committing an act of faith.
Your only escape hatch is the immediate dismissal of said beginner when the wheels come of. No thinking things through, no consideration for said beginners feelings.
This club is in a very serious situation, let there be no doubt of that.
We defeated the bottom club, their manager commented in a perfectly friendly way, that we were without any system, or plan, or shape, or idea of what exactly we wanted to do.
That man was correct, we were outplayed, out thought, out fought.
His spot diagnosis was correct, they won their next game very easily, so we can assume that the bottom place is vacant in the next couple of weeks.
The shameful performance at Leeds was no surprise, with more to follow.
We will not speak about a match with Spurs, because this team under this manager is not fit to give them a game.
It is a matter of grave importance that we steady the ship, that means that someone comes in with that remit, and only that remit.
It will mean players in their correct positions on the pitch, all extraneous players cleared away, bring through a couple more graduates from the academy, and above all start to play matches with a measure of control, even if it means going out there to kill the game.
I realise that this is gloomy, but this belief that he is a typical beginner who will come good is foolish in the extreme.
Werder
There are a lot of suppositions in your assessment.
This is a personal view only, here goes.
The bottom club Barnsley will be above us tut sweet, I’ve seen them.
Stoke and Huddersfield will be above us.
Search as I will I cannot find enough cannon fodder to save us.
We are already chasing clubs who have Five? Points on us.
And of course there is our Manager.
Nope, they are gone, and you cannot even get a good price about them going down.
I have a feeling that the FA cup tie, Boro v Spurs will be chosen for TV live coverage.
Come on BORO.
If it is, then I will stay at home and watch it from the comfort of my armchair. That way I can turn the tv off when it gets to an embarrassing score.
I can’t for the life of me understand what OUR scouts are looking at.
I get you may see a player with a skill set , some really skillful but surely you must ask the question can they do it at speed including speed of thought.
And more importantly bquicker than what you currently have.
Eddie Howe quickly dumped Lee Tomlin , because he realised he couldn’t cope with the speed of the premiership.
GT
Big problem, I do not think we even see them in a match situation(or ten) I really believe that we listen to anyone who puts in a word for them.
Of course there is big money to be made if your word can swing a deal worth millions, know what I mean, nudge nudge wink wink.
Witness the list of worthless players and crocs, and it is a long one.
For what it’s worth I don’t think Boro will be relegated as while we may have performed well below par we’re probably still capable of performing well enough to pick up enough points to finish outside the bottom three – in case anyone was clinging to the false excitement of just escaping relegation 🙁
Werder
Your blog is heartening to any true supporter.
But, unfortunately, even to escape the drop, you must play to a level on every occasion, and that, means being repetitive, if something works then you must repeat it on demand, if you find a combination then you stick with it come what may.
That way, the manager might?, scout the lower leagues and find someone who strengthens the team. Then you are on your way to better yourself, and who knows?
The true horror of our situation is the fact that we are going backward.
Outplayed by the bottom team (we won)
But it did not bode well for a difficult fixture at Leeds, and so it proved, a shaming experience. As quoted on this blog, the statement by the Barnsley Manager proved a portent of things to come.
Leeds was not a pleasant experience, and there will be more to come, because we chose badly when we chose a raw beginner, and anyone with an ounce of sense would have pulled the trigger long ago.
It is big business and should be treated as such.
Any one studying the big clubs will notice that they have no trouble curbing the powerfully clubs by the use of formation and tactics, and they discuss these openly, so why are we left to the mercy of god by a manager who appears to have no idea about any type of coaching or tactics.?
And that’s the point isn’t it? Stay up. Steady the ship financially after Monks horrendous spending spree – Pulis too for that matter.
Interesting game tonight- West Brom v Preston with West Brom patiently passing the ball around and having around 70% possession but no goals. Second half Preston manager got more out of his players with a much closer contest but unfortunately conceded a dodgy late penalty.
The interesting info was that the whole Preston team cost only £2.8 million which clearly shows that there are decent players at bargain prices which other teams find but not Boro.
Increasing debate on the future of Woodgate. I’d be happy with Warnock being appointed to work with Woodgate to the end of the season, a bit like Venables very successfully did with Robson.
Venables was instrumental in changing a team going nowhere to around mid table and was clearly in charge.
I particularly remember one game where he changed the formation after about 20 minutes and the team went on to win.
The only downside to bringing Warnock in, if he improves results and then leaves, then would Woodgate also go ?
Philip
Philip, PNE must be one of the new models thar Mr Gibson is going to follow along with Brentford. Pity we do not have a Manager like Alex Neil.
That is the one big thing SG obviously got wrong when deciding to go down this route.
If Hartlepool overcame Exeter in theirreplay, they would go to Oxford United in the third round.
Not an easy draw as Oxford is fighting for promotion to the Champioship. But the Oxes are at home to Mancheter City in the League Cup Quater Final before Xmas. So they may be tired.
But of course the Pools need to beat Exeter first.
About the Boro. I like the draw versus Spurs. I bet we can see Karanka at the Riverside for that match.
The last time I saw Boro vs. Spurs was when Juninho scored after he missed a penalty. A great match some 20 years ago.
Up the Boro!
Will the Boro players do a lap of honour if they avoid relegation by the time they play their final home match of the season against QPR? Perhaps there should be a trophy to present to the team for achieving such a feat. After all if they won the playoff final in Division 1 at Wembley next season they would be presented with one for gaining promotion to the Championship which would have the same effect as retaining Championship status this season. Perhaps Boro might be able to defer that lap of honour for a couple of weeks as they parade the FA Cup instead. No, I can see Boro going through a whole season without an away which has only happened 3 times in the far distant past, but still avoiding relegation with 10 home wins which is the lowest they have ever achieved in the second tier. After all after winning their third and final League Championship in 1992 Leeds United didn’t win a single away match in the following season which happened to be the first season of the Premier League, but still avoided relegation.
As an aside I note that Dominic Shaw is a ‘Strictly come Dancing’ fan. So am I, and last weekend’s extravaganza with the theme of stage musicals was the best I’ve ever seen, and far more exciting than anything Boro have served up this season with the possible exception of Boro’s display for 35 minutes against Hull City.
Me too Ken re the dancing
Listening this morning on talk sport to the Brighton representative Paul Barbers reasoning on the extension to Graham Potters contract extension, and their thinking behind it, their vision going forward the changes they are making from top to bottom, sports science recruitment, academy etc was really intelligent progressive thinking.
I think its time someone from MFC, spoke as to where they are in their thinking and ambitions.
A well argued piece from Weder and others as well in terms of our current predicament.
It was always going to be a long hard season and despite what may have been said about top half or even top 6 finish, I suspect that The instruction to JW is to avoid relegation. The fact that we are where we are at this stage of the season is due to the inexperience of JW and the naivety of SG thinking that he was the right man. Coupled with injuries which has shown the paucity of our squad who should be performing better.
Appointing JW was not a great decision and a more experienced manager with a bit more about them would have probably turned the job down given the objectives and the way the club is run. So much for Pulis sorting out the club!
I am not entirely sure what it will take for JW to go, maybe he will decide himself if things get too bad and the boo boys really start to get on his back. I don’t think DG will sack him as finding a replacement may be a tad difficult right now. Would anybody really want to come in to sort it out? I suspect not on the salary that we can afford which is not that much!
Anyway, like the masochists that we are, I will be coming up for the Stoke game, I have a prior engagement for Saturday, I have been a Boro supporter for too long and am now old enough to let it bother me to much – it will be what it will be and I will continue to never give up on Boro.
As my mum used to say, worse things happen at sea and given all the recent issues in the country, football is the least of our worries.
UTB
PS – hope to see the FA cup game and see Boro can replicate my first ever FA Cup game when we played West Ham United back in 1970.
Surely continuing with exactly the same players is an exercise in futility. Some of the star youngsters have to be given a chance and I’d also bring back Clayton. I’d be very tempted to play Liddle, Clayton and Walker in place of Wing, McNair (suspended) and Assombalonga (who is clearly not fit).
UTB
Just read from the Echo that our ex is back playing.
Dimi Konstantopoulos has signed non-contract forms with Hartlepool United – and made his return for the club last night.
The giant Greek keeper played in the club’s Durham Challenge Cup 3-0 win over Tow Law at Victoria Park.
He was celebrating his 41st birthday in late November. Great keeper, like. Up the Boro!
JRR Tolkien wrote a trilogy in Lord of The Rings. Pullman’s Dark Materials is a trilogy. Star Wars was originally a trilogy.
They have struggled to make a trilogy out Titanic, the same ship cant hit an iceberg and sink three times.
Will MFC hit an unseen iceberg and go down three times?
It’s a cliche but the next three home games are three cup finals. Particularly the next one against Charlton. Lose against Charlton and I really don’t see how Woodgate can stay in post because that changes “probably will escape relegation” into “hard to see how we can escape relegation under current management.” If we win the next two home games then the pressure is off a little because 7 from 9 at home isn’t great but should be enough to get us over the line. Thing is, without that initial win, the pressure mounts horribly.
Yes we have an injury crisis but so do Charlton and Preston NE for example. Assuming lack of fitness then I would go for:
Pears
Howson Wood Ayala Fry Bola
Wing Clayton/Saville Tav
O’Neill/Walker Fletcher
Bola hasn’t really shone yet but playing at LWB ought to suit him. I think we need to trust Wood for a few games. Clayton or Saville probably depends on what’s happening in training but I think we need to abandon the experiment of Wing as a “quarterback” defensive midfielder. If Wing and Tav have licence to get forwards then my instinct is to turn to Clayton because Saville seems to have disappointed in just about every game he’s played.
O’Neill or Walker depending on training with Britt on the bench if he is fit enough. A lot depends on Fletcher taking on responsibility. With the exception of Howson this puts players in positions they’re used to playing. Wood & O’Neill/Walker will run on adrenaline for a few games and Clayton will have a point to prove.
Bottom line though is that not winning is not an option.
Catching up on my reading on here after being busy with work and I agree with Werder’s excellent piece and how its all come to pass but I differ with him thinking that we won’t get relegated. I’m not sure that there are three worse teams than us this season. We are already four points behind Reading in 18th, now I know that four points isn’t a huge chasm in footballing terms but at the bottom end of the table it is huge, massive in fact for a side thats averaging less than a point per game. That four point gap essentially puts us in a league of six teams scrapping for survival.
It will take Reading to have four negative games where they don’t collect any points and for us to better our less than one PPG average just to pull level with them. One or two victories and of course its all sorted but we have only won three times this season, ironically one of those was against Reading (in what was in hindsight a six pointer), the other two victories were less than impressive wins against Wigan and Barnsley. Being honest I thought and said that Reading looked a decent side when we played them and that they played far better and more confident football. Many felt that Barnsley were unlucky and arguably even the better side last week despite the conditions. None of those wins are exactly reason to believe that we are about to turn a corner anytime soon.
The ghost of Christmas yet to come see’s a Boro side full of Tiny Tim’s. Crippling injuries have wreaked havoc with what little sustenance Woodgate had to work with. Our next three fixtures are Charlton at home then Forest and Swansea away. A point per game average would be an improvement on what we have achieved all season or in simple terms beat Charlton and accept the inevitability of the two away games. For me thats the best we can hope for. No Randolph, Friend, Shotton, Browne, Dijksteel, Johnson, McNair and probably Britt means that the side that has scraped less than a point a game is decimated by at least 50% dependant upon selection and even those not selected from that list would have definitely been on the bench and that excludes the expensive perma crock who I simply can’t be bothered to even name.
The side we field on Saturday will be a weak one, which considering we have been fielding weak sides all season makes it extremely weak indeed. I hope we win but I have to admit that I think Charlton will see this fixture as very winnable. Just imagine if we go behind and the Riverside atmosphere reacts with jeers echoing around the swathes of empty plastic. Its a tough ask for the Kids and the only thing that may keep the mob mentality at bay.
After those three games we then have the other two games that we are pinning our big hopes on, Stoke and Huddersfield at home. Huddersfield are spluttering a bit having won two, drew two and lost two of their last six but those defeats were against Preston and Bristol City having taken a whopping 8 points against our massive 6 points in the same period. I think a draw based on current form would be the best we can hope for although a win is an absolute must but that mounting pressure for a win could implode badly.
Before that Boxing day fixture against the Terriers we will have played Stoke who have also like us amassed 6 points in their last six games. Again in theory its doable but a lot will depend upon how Michael O’Neill has had a chance to influence his new Club between now and then and get his disciplined organised Northern Ireland tactics instilled. Our last game of 2019 is away to the Baggies, lets be realistic here if we can keep it to just the four that Leeds put past us that will be some achievement because I fear the worst for that one so much so that they might consider moving the fixture to Edgbaston so the scoreboard can cope.
Never mind because on New Years day just three days after the Baggies with minds mentally battered we face Alex Neil’s Preston at Deepdale. Then we are home to Wayne Rooney’s Derby and away to Fulham to take us into mid January. I genuinely fear that there could well be sizeable damage done already by that time with the Engine Room flooded and life-jackets being tossed overboard in the form of selling Randolph, Ayala and whoever else might float as we find ourselves adrift.
So there we have it, a difficult end to the year and an even more difficult start in January with the behind the scenes distractions, rumours and counter rumours of whose agent was speaking to who, who is “missing training”, who has a mystery niggle/virus and who has had a training ground bust up to engineer a move. Throw in a Head Coach who is already very clearly out of his depth and has been nobbled from the off by the Senior Executives and I see absolutely nothing that gives me any positive signs for belief or encouragement. Twenty minute purple patches every half a dozen games hasn’t and isn’t going to change our fate.
If something is to change it needs to be radical and it needs to be very quick because time like games are now running out. The very fact that I am saying games are running out and we haven’t even kicked a ball in December speaks volumes about either myself or MFC and right now the only thing I am confident in is my own projections.
If I wasn’t depressed before, then I am now!
Thing is, it it very true and sadly, I can see it coming to pass.
We just need a Christmas miracle, three wise men to follow a star and a few angels telling us the good news.
Redcar Red,
Bang on as a state of the nation speech and Christmas radio address. When will the cryogenically sleeping top executives rouse themselves? (I deliberately didn’t say suspended animation because that sounds livelier.) No post-Christmas slump this season just a new year total implosion. Boro are cannon fodder now.
Even playing some of the U23’s would guarantee them being played out of position and square-pegged because of some spurious tactics.
Depressingly,
UTB,
John
Very worrying to read all the talk of,” it’s the wrong time, too early, can’t afford to sack him”.
The ship is holed and taking in water, the engine has failed, and there are no lifeboats.
Please can we act now, as we should have acted after 6-7 matches.
Just listen to him, out of his own mouth, the endless wretched statements, never making sense, never talking tactics, never understanding how or why we were beaten yet again.
Utterly unable to simply stop the opposition scoring, not a clue, scorers playing in defence, defenders playing in midfield, right sided defenders on the left, and vice versa.
For gods sake get a manager in, but in the meantime fire him, the players would do better without his interference.
I think he should never have been appointed under any circumstances but especially under these circumstances when because of the cut backs and restrictions an experienced Manager was needed more than ever. His head will roll eventually to try and save what little face the Senior Execs have left and therein lies the real root cause of the problem. A plausible spin will no doubt have to be created or engineered before they act so they foolishly believe that the fans will buy into their new vision.
It wasn’t Woodgate who signed Gestede and agreed terms, it wasn’t Woodgate who paid £15M for Britt and the package to go with it, it wasn’t Woodgate who signed Saville and Fletcher and Co. for the amounts they paid. It wasn’t Woodgate who brought Downing back with a ridiculous contract. It wasn’t Woodgate who sold Bamford to buy Flint/Saville and to loan Besic and Hugill along with their fees. It wasn’t Woodgate who claimed to have left the Club in a healthy state. All that coming from me, someone who never wanted Woodgate anywhere near the club let alone Managing it (or Coaching to use a modern day euphemism) illustrates just how bad things appear to be.
The same problem has presided over many disastrous appointments and the sanctioning of ridiculous deals with little to no forward consequential forecasting or planning. The same problem actually sanctioned, approved and signed off all the above “deals”. Sacking Karanka to expect Agnew to save us was the start of the latest slide after a brief momentary upturn and yet as bad as that was the unbelievable just continued. Whether that problem is just one man himself or a combination of Gill, Bausor and Bevington we will probably never know but I can’t think of a positive outcome from any of them. Sacking Woodgate is just one part of the root cause of our free-falling demise.
Fitting a new roof will stop the leaks temporarily but if the walls are suffering from subsidence and the foundations are sinking then there is no amount of crack plastering that will fix things regardless of how shiny the new roof may look in the first few months. If it lasts until the Summer then thats about as much as we can expect but then what? All the experienced and best players gone for nothing and like as not buying more League One dross? If we think this season is bad just wait until what next season has in store for us!
RR
A great post which encapsulates my feelings as well.
After missing the last few games I must admit I am fast losing interest in the whole club, players management and all.
If I feel like this after over 53 years supporting them all over the UK and Europe then what about those that have just seen the glory years?
The club is in turmoil and something must give !
OFB
We’ll put RR Nd very difficult to argue against.
It isn’t over yet, but unless something changes very very soon it will be over very very soon.
My only consolation is despite the disastrous first four months of the season Boro are not in the bottom three – therefore I’d like to think that the switch in tactics to a back five and some players showing better form will keep us out of the relegation zone.
OK, I think it’s easy to make the opposite case too given what we have witnessed but before the Leeds game I think only two teams in the Championship had lost fewer games in their previous five as Boro. But for Johnson’s dismissal we would probably have notched up another win but that’s really been the story of the season with many dropped points being self inflicted.
Much will depend on what happens in December, especially against Charlton, Stoke and Huddersfield – wins at the bottom tend to be precious as the bottom ten clubs have only won 9 of their collective last 50 games – with three of those nine victories belonging to Reading. So any win will lift you up the table and particularly wins against relegation rivals probably count double at least.
The worry is that Boro under Woodgate will continue to find ways to fail and there could likely come a point at which excuses and time will run out.
The last posts from Plato, RR and OFB are all pretty damning of the position that our club currently finds itself in.
There is not much that I can disagree with or indeed add to the views held.
My Boro history goes back to 1968/9 and having lived away all that time I have not been as close as others especially pre inter web days. I do feel that we are at a crossroads and Mr Gibson needs to make some tough decisions very quickly if the slide is to be halted.
Any football club relies on its supporters and at our level once you lose them, it is hard to bring back. 10000 on a Tuesday night in February is not going to keep the club afloat I would suggest. History shows that, for whatever reason, when we fall from grace, unlike other clubs, our support dwindles and in the current economic climate, there is less chance of it holding firm.
As OFB says, if us long or old timers are getting disenfranchised, then that indicates a serious problem for SG.
I still think that he has lost interest which is somewhat worrying and if there is no action taken soon, I think this will prove it.
However, a couple of wins and who knows, that is football for you!
Two very good posts RR, so much so, they should be forwarded to Mr Gibson and his cohorts.
I really do wonder what answer / excuses they would come up with.
I really do not see how we can avoid relegation even though we have just entered December.
If we do fail and fall then everything that Mr Gibson has achieved since 1986 will count for nothing, especially with the younger (than most on here) fans. Relegation to League 1 will be his epitaph
Just to make it worse RR, my niece (when she visits for Christmas) has never in seven Boxing Day Riverside visits seen a win. Nothing to say that will change.
A truthful post BBD and in truth very sad.
What makes it worse for me is that this need not of happened with better decision making over the last few years.
Whilst I am sure Mr Gibson is concerned, his continued silence and I might say arrogance towards the supporters is really disappointing. Something is very wrong within and it does not look as though it will be corrected.
Agreed – as you say, this could have been avoided. I am not sure when the rot set in although the following all could be on the charge sheet
1. Not getting rid of AK after Charltongate
2. Getting rid of AK when he did and putting SA in charge
3. saying that we would smash the league and then putting GM in charge of the tuck shop money with no controls
4. Getting rid of GM when he did
5. getting TP to replace him
6. Not getting rid of TP after the Villa play off debacle and continuing with him for the following season
7. Appointment of JW with no DoF to help him
Pick one!
With the possible exception of #1, every one of those decisions has failed. I personally think AK should have gone then but clearly the rot that generated Charltongate needed digging out there and then, and it wasn’t.
Is Woodgate really doing such a terrible job as some proclaim?
Wafer thin squad hit with terrible injuries – and some misfortune it could be added. The Leeds result can be discounted completely in my opinion due to the circumstances and Leeds being bloody good.
Word is he’s the hardest working person in the club; a local lad who is now also giving youth lads a chance. Things fans said they wanted.
Sacking Woodgate would cost money and so would hiring a replacement.
Only an absolute top coach would have made a difference to Saturday’s result. Look at the 2 games before and we did well before Johnson’s red and scraped an ugly win in torrential rain midweek.
Get off your high horses and give him a chance!
UTB
Clem
Not high horses we have seen at close quarters bad coaching decisions and poor substitutions
Most are blaming Gibson for
Lack of Of Investment
Lack of help for coaching staff
Lack of recruitment of players
You can’t really blame the bloggers for having a whinge when we are genuinely concerned about getting relegated
Interesting that EFL confident to get 21 point deduction for Sheffield Wednesday confirmed
Derby next on the target list for points deducted
OFB
The Wednesday thing sounds similar to our Blackburn no show. The Owls claim that they have emails and proof of communication seeking clarification from the EFL that what they were doing was not in breach:
“The club maintains that it consulted with the relevant executive officers of the EFL in connection with the stadium transaction and that it acted in good faith.
“The club has in its possession numerous emails, letters and other documents in which the EFL gave authorisation to the transaction, and on which authorisation the club understood it could rely.
“That authorisation gave rise in law to a legitimate expectation that the transaction would be accepted by the EFL, which is binding on the EFL”.
I wonder if the EFL’s laptop was broken?
Ok, I think most of us accept that some of the issues cannot be laid at the door of JW, as RR points out, he has not been responsible for the waifer thin squad, the poor recruitment and over inflated salaries paid to underperforming players.
However, given where we are in the league, how much of a chance do you give him? That is not A criticism but a genuine question because to my mind something needs to change.
I accept Leeds are playing well but we are the only team thus far that have conceded 4 against them and we have only won 3 games and at an average of less than 1 point a game.
Well we’re not in the bottom 3 – let’s see where we are after Christmas where a new manager could bring on a few of his know leaders or like.
I think he’ll stick with him though for budget reasons
I don’t think anyone is judging based on Saturdays result, it wasn’t the first time we conceded four goals this season. Our league predicament or position tells a story of underachievement. Although weaker the Squad isn’t as bad as the position we are now in. The injuries are a recent thing but the results were not there before they started to seriously mount.
The first half against Hull was indeed much better but the half time decision after the dismissal to sit in our own 18 yard box for 45 minutes is a more accurate measure of his tactical acumen (and those of his fellow inexperienced Coaches). When the opposition Coach changed tactics mid way through to take advantage there was no response, no changes to our tactics, no outlets, absolutely nothing.
Starting the season off trying to play with a back four and attacking exciting football with the squad he was dealt was a very obvious measure of naive stupidity. Taking so long to realise the obvious had cost us valuable points.
I don’t ever recall reading anywhere that the fans wanted a local lad in charge considering all the talk and excitement was about Jokanovic and Hughton and numerous others, even calls for Karanka to come back, none of which are hardly local. The “local lad” was part of the spin engineered to try and sell the fans a sick pup. Being relegated could cost the club a heck of a lot more money than retaining his services for sentimental reasons. To date there has been nothing to make me think that he is a great and insightful Coach or even an up and coming one. His interviews only highlight this concern and indeed add unwanted weight to nicknames from earlier on in his playing career.
The “ugly win” Barnsley was only the third win this season and to be playing at home against the bottom side with only 37% possession isn’t exactly an endorsement especially coming after the Hull game. I have no doubt he is the first one into the Club and last one out every day nor do I doubt that he wants Boro to be successful but being hard working doesn’t equate to success in any walk of life, working smarter not harder brings results.
I was vehemently against his appointment to put it mildly and have sat back and watched the Club do exactly what I feared it would but resisted the “I told you so” or “karma” comments because seeing Boro in such a sorry mess gives me zero pleasure. If I wanted to be on a high horse there is plenty of ammunition to give Woodgate pelters but even I recognise that where we are isn’t solely down to him and if you asked most blokes down a Teesside Pub do they want the job there wouldn’t be many who would have declined.
I think the vast majority would t have the bottle!
Appreciate as I said not great but he’s inexperienced and I do remember and understand many reasons for not appointing him but budget wasn’t going to allow anything else
RR
Excellent post and I echo every sentiment !
Anyway I wouldn’t be able to get on a high horse 🐎 !
OFB
MFC are not in the bottom three and I doubt they will be at the end of this seasons fixtures ( although it could be a pretty close thing).
I think the chairman will persevere with the present incumbents, unless they suddenly find themselves well adrift in the relegation survival battle.
Will the chairman blink? I reckon JW and his colleagues will be ensuring he gets regular applications of Optrex……..
But that is then arguably too late………
I’m sorry but I can’t blame Gibson for perceived lack of investment. He threw plenty of cash at Monk and Pulis in the last couple of seasons. SG above reproach IMO.
Appreciate fans opining here and not booing or suchlike at matches yes sorry if I sounded inflammatory.
I’ve only made 5 games this season and it’s been dull yes and worrying yes. I just think we need to stick with Woodgate. Look when The Mackems slipped into decline with Grayson, Coleman etc. doing no better than the last man in charge. Sometimes graft does make the difference and if you get rid of him then who knows…
The biggest error for me is the lack of coaches. Keane is part time, Leo a GK.
UTB
I don’t even think its a perceived lack of Gibson’s investment thats the main point, we accept that he has had to fork out a personal fortune in the summer and if he wants to build Hotels or Mansions then he is entitled to do so.
Its the quality and rationality of his spending on behalf of MFC that is now being held up to scrutiny which is directly attributable to where we are now. Some of the buying and selling has been head scratching and the costs and contracts awarded with them simply staggering.
Clem, we all have our opinions.
However I do not recall anybody on here calling about lack of investment, if you could call it such a thing.
The complaint about Mr Gibson, (from me certainly) are his poor football business decisions for the last number of years.
Clem
Don’t apologise this blog is to generate discussion. And we all get passionate about our club.
I must confess these posts have stirred me from my solitude and somnolence and I now intend to use my season card and go to the game with Mrs OFB on Saturday!
I’ll go for my usual ⚽️⚽️
OFB
Supporting Boro is an addiction that can never be cured!
OFB,
The world is straightening up and getting on an even keel at last..
A predictable prediction. Excellent. I almost feel optimistic, I exaggerate.
Good to see you feeling better too.
UTB,
John
OFB
Good to hear you are well enough to steel yourself for a visit to the Riverside. Hope it proves to be a tonic and not a relapse! 😎
Clem
That is the very point that is enraging us fans, the utterly incompetent signing of worthless players on long contracts and big wages.
Once your recruitment goes downhill the entire edifice collapses.
Several of the above signings shove out better players, your results suffer, you want to sell the wasters, they are going nowhere, because they are on money they only dreamed about. Sound familiar?
It gets worse, someone must go to raise money, exit three or four very good players, Bamford anyone, Traore, same as, Gibson,? The list goes on. And still we are told that our perma Croc Gestede will soon be fit.
Do they think that we are idiots?
Agree that the tactic of signing other clubs players of the season hasn’t worked. Strangely.
Had a long discussion today with a friend regarding SG and the apparent stepping back and involvement he has shown for the past two years which has been more markedly shown this season.
Not surprisingly it was alleged that he wants to sell and this came from someone who hears these rumours at a high corporate level.
It is something that we have all discussed and expressed an opinion about but I wonder if this rumour is unfounded or not ?
OFB
A bit of a chuckle, for me at least!
I watched a Times video by Rod Liddle about that event on the 12th December.
He interviewed Roy ‘Chubby’ Brown. Not someone I normally watch but he made a comment, in summary, ‘Corbyn and Johnson were in a lift and Dolly Parton walked in, a case of two big T*ts and a country and western artist’
Made me chuckle but I am sad. Werder, please feel free to edit.
Ian
Well you do have to keep abreast with these politicians !
And also have a good laugh as a titter went round the room……
OFB
On the subject of Dolly Parton….does anyone know anything about the Middlesbrough Women’s Team. They don’t seem to be affiliated with MFC. Does anyone know why not? It would seem to be a logical way to broaden the appeal of the club to the community.
I see that they have a WFACup tie against Sunderland on Monday. Best of luck to the team.
UTWB?
Randell Williams at Exeter looks a decent forward, fast and direct right age ,right price.
Came through the Watford system.
The Hartlepool Mail have published an article of where ‘data experts’ have Boro finishing with 49 points and 21st position being 2 points more than Wigan who will be relegated along with Luton and Barnsley. There doesn’t appear now then to be not much point in clubs playing any more league matches, so maybe we should concentrate on the FA Cup which of course we have every chance of winning with plenty of rest between each round.
I think the Mail predictions are probably close to the mark at this stage but the key thing is that they have it as close as two points to surviving or dropping down to League One. Those slim margins potentially mean a last day of the Season nail biter. I’m pretty sure that isn’t what MFC had in mind during the Summer.
RR
With regard to your last sentence I am sure you are correct. However this is “typical boro”we are talking about and as you know we never do things the easy way.
All joking aside, if we fail to get positive results from the up coming home games against our relegation opponents, then I fear the worst and the Mail prediction will be incorrect. 😎
It will of course mean that Exmil’s challenge should still take place…
Unless things change, it is highly likely that this will be a last day nail-biter. There are really only two ways to change things: new players or a new manager.
I thought appointing Woodgate was a mistake; not because of who he is but because appointing someone who has never managed before to oversee cuts while keeping us safe from relegation was a mistake.
Right now I think the best way to avoid relegation is bringing in 2-3 instant first team players and a new manager. Clearly the whole club needs some sort of root and branch overhaul. Pulis seems to have started that because there was an unexpectedly large churn of coaching staff.
One thing though. To be fair to him, I think Woodgate is showing signs that he may develop into a decent manager. It’s just that what he has been asked to do would have been beyond any first-time manager.
I’m determined to disagree with you one day, deleriad. Once again, however, I can’t. Good post.
My rather facetious remarks were aimed at the so-called panel of experts. We all know it’s impossible for anyone to forecast the final 27 rounds of the season for 24 clubs in this Division for Boro or anyone else. But if they had a crystal ball we might as well concentrate on the FA Cup. How many times have Boro been eliminated from the FA Cup with the comments being that we can now concentrate on the League. Of course I can’t vouch for those comments prior to the Second World War, but they’ve regularly been uttered in my lifetime. So let’s look at some pre-war facts about Boro in the FA Cup.
Firstly for a club who had spent 29 years of its first 36 year existence in the First Division it’s FA Cup record was abysmal. Only 4 times had Boro reached the Quarterfinal of what was then hailed the greatest Cup competition in the World. Before entering the Second Division in 1899 they had even lost to Redcar in 1886, although Redcar did also beat Sunderland that year and actually reached the Quarterfinal themselves. The 4 Quarterfinals defeats by Boro were 0-2 at home to Crewe Alexandra in 1888 (admittedly as a Northern League team), 0-1
at home to West Brom in 1901, 1-3 at home to Manchester City in 1904, and 1-3 away to Grimsby Town some 32 years later in 1936. Along the way they were hammered 1-6 in 1906 by Southampton who at the time were a Southern League club, 0-5 at Second Division Hull City in 1922 and 1-6 at Wolves in 1937, all those heavy defeats when Boro were a First Division club. Even as Second Division Champions in 1927 with George Camsell’s 59 League goals Boro got no further than the 5th Round as Third Division Millwall beat Boro 3-2. Boro’s biggest wins in the FA Cup had been 11-0 against Scarborough in a group of qualifying matches in 1890 and 9-3 at home to non-league Goole Town in 1915 when Jackie Carr, George Elliott and Walter Tinsley each scored a hat trick.
So what about the postwar years? Well I’ve previously mentioned the 1946/47 Season when Boro were cheated out of a Semifinal place by Second Division Burnley. Leading 1-0 with only minutes remaining on a snow covered pitch Johnny Morris blatantly handled in the equaliser, Boro lost the replay 0-1. There was also the 1951 match at Second Division Leeds when the mist turned to thick fog as Boro lost 0-1 when it was impossible to see the centre spot even from the touchline. Then the following Season when Boro were humiliated by Second Division Doncaster Rovers 1-4 at Ayresome Park.
Who can forget the big freeze of 1963 when Boro as a Second Division club having beaten First Division Blackburn 3-1 were asked to play Leeds 5 days later in 4th Round, the day when the 5th Round was scheduled to be played. Of course Boro lost 0-2 but both matches attracted crowds of nearly 40,000 which was way above the season’s League average. But at last some cheer in 1970. Having seen off West Ham with their 3 England World Cup heroes 2-1, Boro with the luck of the draw reached their first Quarterfinal for 23 years with a home tie against Manchester United which included Bobby Charlton, Dennis Law and George Best. John Hickton scored for Boro to earn a replay, and again in the replay which Boro lost 1-2. Boro were to meet Manchester United in 3 successive seasons, winning 2-1 in 1971 after a goalless draw at Old Trafford.
But despite winning promotion easily under Jack Charlton in 1974, Boro still managed to lose a Fourth Round tie 0-1 at Third Division Wrexham. However Boro now as a First Division club struggled to beat non-league Wycombe Wanderers 1-0 in a replay, Sunderland 3-1 at home, and Peterborough 2-0 also in a
replay before facing Birmingham City at St Andrews in another
Quarterfinal. Having won there 3-0 in the opening League match of the season, Boro were expected to at least earn a replay, but of course lost 0-1 to a Bob Hatton goal. Two years later Boro beat Arsenal 4-1 to earn another Quarterfinal tie, this time away to Liverpool which they lost 0-2. But Boro had by then become a difficult team to beat especially at home in the FA Cup and in 1978 beat 2 First Division teams at Coventry City
3-0 and Everton 3-2 before comedian Freddie Starr in the director’s box. After beating Second Division Bolton in the 5th Round a 4th consecutive home tie against Leyton Orient beckoned, but again Boro fell short with a goalless draw and lost the replay 1-2.
In 1981 Boro’s match at Swansea was televised because it was deemed a possible Cup upset, but Boro were never troubled and won 5-0 with Terry Cochrane scoring with a wonderful overhead kick. With 2 more home wins 1-0 against West Brom and 2-1 against Barnsley, Boro had reached their 5th Quarterfinal in the space of 11 years, but once again were denied a Semifinal place this time by Wolves losing 1-3 after extra time following a 1-1 draw at Ayresome Park. A lean spell followed as far as the FA Cup was concerned. Although beating Arsenal 3-2 in 1984 Boro lost 0-1 to Notts County on the 5th Round, to Darlington the year after and to Cambridge United in 1991.
The tide turned in 1997 with an easy 6-0 win against Chester, a struggling 3-2 win against non-league Hednesford Town, but magnificent wins 1-0 away to Manchester City and a 2-0 at Derby to at last reach the Semifinals where 3rd Division Chesterfield stood in their way. Boro 1-2 down and with Vladimir Kinder having been sent off, Boro were fortunate not to be 1-3 down which VAR might have confirmed or not. But the 10 men of Boro took the lead with a Craig Hignett penalty and a Gianluca Festa goal only for Chesterfield to find a late equaliser. Nevertheless Boro won the replay 3-0 and reached their first FA Cup Final. But as we all know the concession of a goal in less than a minute followed by a second after halftime with Boro already relegated soured the occasion somewhat.
However now firmly ensconced in the Premier League in 2002 Boro with wins against Wimbledon, Manchester United, Blackburn and Everton without conceding a goal found themselves in their second Semifinal at Old Trafford against Arsenal where they were possibly unfortunate to lose 0-1. A third Semifinal came in 2006 where Boro needed 3 replays against Nuneaton Borough, Coventry and Charlton Athletic plus a win at Preston seeing Boro pitted against West Ham who Boro had already beaten 2-0 only 6 days before. After outplaying the Hammers in the first half without scoring, Boro eventually lost 0-1 to a Dean Aston goal if I remember correctly. That season Boro played a total of 64 matches including their fantastic run to Eindhoven in the EUFA Cup. That was the start of a run of 4 successive seasons in which Boro reached at least the Quarterfinal of the FA Cup. The following season it was Manchester United who were lucky to beat Boro with a controversial goal at the Riverside, with Boro losing the replay 0-1, then the shambles in the following season with the 0-2 defeat to Second Division Cardiff City, and in 2009 the 1-2 defeat at Goodison Park to Everton. The strange thing is that West Ham, Manchester United, Cardiff City and Everton all reached the Final, but all lost to Liverpool, Chelsea, Portsmouth and Chelsea respectively.
Boro have only reached the Quarterfinal once since in 2017 having again been lucky with the draw giving them 4 home ties against Sheffield Wednesday, Accrington Stanley, Oxford United and Manchester City who got revenge for the 2-0 win 2 years before. The FA Cup has nowadays become a source of income for the lower league clubs if they can get a tie against a top Premier League club, but is often treated disdainfully by many clubs in the top 2 Divisions. The top 6 Premier League clubs still record great home attendances even when naming a team comprising of players who are not first team regulars until the Quarterfinals or beyond. Will Spurs do likewise by resting some of their best players? If they do it’s not inconceivable that Boro might spring a surprise as Rochdale almost did 2 season’s ago.
It’s sad now that for most clubs attendances have generally declined, whereas 10 years ago Boro often had gates approaching 30,000 even against lower Division clubs, which begs the question of whether the top clubs should be barred from entering in the following season if they continue to rest several first team regulars. Players seem to still love FA Cup matches, but managers less so. In conclusion then is Boro’s forthcoming match with Spurs likely to see Boro reach a crowd of 30,000 in the hope of seeing the Londoners playing a full strength team, or a measly 12,000 if it turns out to be Tottenham reserves?
With it being shown in pubs and clubs and on the telly unless we see an impressive Christmas upturn in results I think 15,000 would be as good a turnout as the Club could expect for the Spurs Cup match. How times have changed sadly.
I can’t understand why some of my sentences have large gaps between them as I was meticulous in proof reading when there were no such gaps. So I can only apologise for that.
It looks OK on my laptop Ken, I’m guessing its maybe a Windows versus Apple iPad thing going on. No doubt Werder will be able to explain.
Ken
You’re probably using London Tube System Software!
“Mind the gap…”
OFB
I see Robbie Keane was in the Granite City watching Sam Cosgrove against Rangers this week. Already there are price tags of £4M being put on the lads head which seems extreme considering the risk is he could bomb down here along with a long list of Scottish players..
My alternative “smart” money (i.e. budget buy) would be Ross County Striker Ross Stewart, 23 years old and only two goals behind him with seven goals to Cosgrove’s nine. Cosgrove’s nine includes three penalties versus Stewart’s seven are all from open play. I would imagine its a heck of a sight harder scoring seven for Ross County than it is nine including three penalties for third placed Aberdeen!
I would bet a pound to a penny that Aberdeen would look to Ross County and Stewart as a £250K replacement for Cosgrove and pocketing the remainder.
RR, you are on the money there. 4mil for an unknown playing in Scotland. Too much of a gamble. Don’t we have a loanee scoring goals up there? I wonder how we could afford 4mil if that really is in fact the figure, unless we sell say Randolph?
I think its just a contingency if someone comes in with a serious offer for Gestede 🙂
Seriously though the post parachute payment state of the Clubs finances would indicate that if offers came in for any of the big earners we would accept it. Some will be on salaries of £1M to £1.5M which is unsustainable with the clubs present income.
Some have contracts up in the Summer and will be worthless and may have to be sold at cut price just to recoup some cash plus save on 6 months Salary until June. An example may be a Player we would reasonably expect to value at say £4M but being sold off for £500K (or “undisclosed”) which is better than nothing plus another £500K in salary savings adding up to £1M.
If say Bristol offered £7M for Britt we may have to accept it to balance books so having a low cost back up makes sense (not at £4M hopefully). We are back to the Jutkiewicz era when it comes to shopping (in fairness he could do a job for us now). The other alternative is to hang on to those out of contract in the hope of surviving and then worry about the losses in the Summer but to rebuild will take some cash and so the temptation I think will be to sell what we can and still hope there is enough left to hang on in the Championship.
The same goes for Randolph. Pears or Mejias will be considered as acceptable if we get a serious offer for him hence I suspect why we are being lined with a grossly overpriced 28 year old from Northampton. There may be an unwritten plan/thinking that cash in on Britt and Randolph and we can afford to make Ayala a decent offer and perhaps Howson, at least enough to persuade them not to uproot their families and stay plus replace the outgoing with a low cost replacements.
With Pears we have two Goalkeeping Coaches plus the Lads Father probably giving him plenty of advice so in principle he could step up and meanwhile we have to accept that one or two interim errors hopefully won’t cost us games. The gamble in the Summer has back fired and shows no sign of suddenly turning a corner now made worse with injuries. On other news Everton have sacked Silva after only four wins in fifteen his season with rumours of them going back to Moyes.
The coming match is yet another must win, or not.
I must admit I have an uncomfortable feeling about this match. A bit like the August game under Schteve when a Curbishley side ran us ragged. We were staying at my sons Uni house in Newcastle and I decided a family day was better than the 39 mile journey and tickets.
We had a great day with fish and chips in Tynemouth, pitch and put in Whitley Bay, my wife and daughter heading in to town on the Metro. Alex and I went to a local put in Jesmond and watched a dismal game.
Luckily we watched the end of England beating The Aussies in the 2005 Ashes series.
I hope OFB has a great day, it would be well deserved, just need RR pulling his finger out and report a hatful of goals for Boro.
I think a win is an absolute must tomorrow. We are now in the stage of looking at points from “winnable” games. Dropping those points cannot be tolerated if we are to average a point per game as an absolute survival minimum.
Cosgrove, you’ve got to be kidding me, he’s as stiff as a board.
He makes Billy Ashcroft look like Van Basten.
GT Shhhhhhhhhhh,
Slow lumbering, limited and overpriced, just what our Recruitment team find attractive. Stop bulling him up!
As Everton sacked their manager, it is interesting to compare him to Woody.
Former Hull City boss Silva succeeded Sam Allardyce at Goodison Park. He was brought in with the hope of his side playing more attractive football and backed with almost £90m of signings in the summer of 2018.
Everton finished eighth in Silva’s first campaign but, after spending more than £100m on players in the summer, they have won just four league games this season.
How much did we spend on new players since Woody took over? Peanuts and not anywhere near Everton did.
Everton’s problem might be buying too many players at a time, our not signing enough.
Up the Boro!
Very good point Jarrko, opposite extremes ending with the same result.
As in all things in life its all about balance!
OK, as we get ever closer to the big vote, Woodgate will be looking for a healthy majority of points from the upcoming fixtures as he hopes to canvass support in his bid to avoid deselection. With three struggling teams arriving at the Riverside in December the head coach could be at serious risk of losing his seat. Anyway, here’s my view on matters with the latest discussion blog article…
https://diasboro.club/2019/12/06/2019-20-weeks-18-19-woodgate-given-proxy-vote-of-confidence/